The line between the two is darn thin, and come Thanksgiving weekend, we'll know on which side the Oklahoma State athletic director belongs.
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He took a big gamble Tuesday, announcing that there would be no single-game tickets sales for Bedlam football. This is the biggest annual sporting event in the state and one of the best rivalries in the country. This is a game about bragging rights and divided loyalties and, many a year, a trip to the Big 12 championship game.
And the Cowboys could have their smallest crowd next season when the Sooners come to Stillwater.
Egad.
Don't chalk up Holder as a madman just yet. Hold off on that raving lunatic talk.
Why?
His plan might actually work.
About this time last year, Iowa State decided it would sell no single-game tickets to the Iowa game. If you wanted to see the Big Game, as the corn-fed locals call it, you had to buy a season ticket.
No ifs, ands or buts.
When Iowa's Speaker of the House called and wanted to buy 175 tickets at face value for the Big Game, Iowa State athletic director Jamie Pollard told him that wouldn't be a problem. All he'd need to do was buy 175 season tickets.
Much like folks here, the good people of Iowa were torn over the idea of having to buy a season ticket to see the in-state rivalry. Some gushed that it was a stroke of marketing brilliance. Others lamented that it was an ill-advised move for the school.
Attendance at the Big Game: 49,516.
That was not a sellout at Iowa State's 50,000-seat Jack Trice Stadium. It was also the smallest crowd to see an Iowa-Iowa State game since the series resumed in 1977.
Thing is, Iowa State still ended up having one of its best years for attendance. The Cyclones' average home attendance was 49,462. They hadn't averaged that many fans in 20 years.
Had their average attendance busted the 50,000-fan mark, it would've been the first time since 1982.
All that despite a team that finished 3-9.
The most season tickets that Iowa State had ever sold was 30,728, but last season, that record jumped to more than 36,000, a 14.6 percent increase.
The most season tickets that OSU has ever sold came in 2004. On the heels of a nine-win, Cotton Bowl season, the Cowboys had 38,674 season-ticket holders. If they have the same kind of success that the Cyclones did, their season-ticket sales will spike to more than 44,000.
But will they?
And what of the average attendance?
It's impossible to know for sure. There are some indications, though, that the success of the season-ticket plan at Iowa State just might be duplicated at OSU.
For starters, OSU has a better product to sell than Iowa State. The Cowboys have been to consecutive bowls and five in the past six seasons. The Cyclones haven't been to a bowl the past two seasons.
Then, there's the excitement factor. Iowa State made the change in ticket policy at a time when its fans were excited about the hiring of new coach Gene Chizik, who was lured from Texas. The fervor at OSU is over the massive upgrades under construction at Boone Pickens Stadium
One of the big differences in the two schools' plans — ticket prices.
OSU's cheapest season ticket costs $294, almost twice as much as Iowa State's. Spending $150 to buy a season ticket to see just one game is a sacrifice, but it's still realistic. Remember, single-game tickets for Bedlam two years ago in Stillwater cost $100, and you can bet they were sold on the street for more than that.
A fan could buy a $150 season ticket, use the big-game ticket, then stomach eating the rest of them.
Doing that with a $294 season ticket isn't as palatable, whether you're a Cowboy or Sooner.
No doubt Mike Holder is rolling the dice with this idea. His plan might backfire in his face, leaving thousands of empty seats for Bedlam and several hundreds of thousands of dollars on the table. Then again, he might have set in motion a plan that will reap millions for OSU.
This is what successful businessmen do. They create demand for their supply, and they sometimes take risks to do so.
Suppose Holder might have learned a thing or two about that from his good buddy Boone Pickens?
The oil tycoon has had some risks bite him in the backside, but he's also made his share of greenbacks. Holder is simply trying to do the same for OSU.
Is he crazy or genius?
We'll find out Nov. 29.
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Why does Gary always comment on OSU stories? News flash Gary we could care less about your opinion, which is based on idiocy. You are the definition of a mOUron!
As long at T Boone is willing to pay the bill, OSU has the ability to do this. With Pickens money, they don't need fans at all. This isn't as risky as Jenny or others claim.
We'll find out if this ticket policy is a success long before November 29, Jenny. Clearly, Holder is showing that attendance for the OU game is of secondary importance compared to the number of season tickets sold. He wants to grow the base of season-long supporters even if that means lower attendance for the big game.
Jenni can't do homework, especially Math. That would be to much like right. She doesn't get her facts straight and she writes snippy, stupid articles that are crap and garbage.
Maybe Jenni should do a little bit better homework on ticket prices.
The prices she quotes for Iowa State are not actually seats. That price is for sitting on the grass on the hillside, general admission area with limited restroom and concession facilities. For an actual seat at an Iowa State game for 2008 the season ticket price is $350 for a 6 game home schedule. That works out to $58.33 per game.
You can get a season ticket for OSU for 2008 for $294 in the Family Fun Zone for a 7 game home schedule, which equates to $42 per ticket. Or if you want a better seat a season ticket will cost you $419, an average of $59.86 per ticket. Slighty above what ISU is charging, and for a team that has at least been to and won a bowl game the last 2 years versus ISU's 7-17 record the past 2 years.
Leave it to Jenni to once again not do her research and skew the facts. She is the worst excuse of a 'journalist' that I have ever had the displeasure of reading.
i don't think meth heads like football...they like meth. the only wife beaters i see (notice) at football games....well....never mind. and all schools have their share of rude, classless fans, be it students, alums or trailer park trash, its just that winning programs atrack more of the later.
OSU is trying to make it bigger than it is. It is a big game for them not OU. Once every 6,7 or 8 years they win one and once every 20 years they win two in a row. OOOO Big time NOT!!
"This is a game about bragging rights and divided loyalties and, many a year, a trip to the Big 12 championship game." A trip only for OU. OSU SUX AZZ.
Why do OU fans care about OSU's ticket policy? Holder is trying to get more OSU fans in the seats. I think it is great. I ordered two season tickets today. I can't wait to watch the OU/OSU games with my fellow Cowboy fans!!
Ben, what about all of the toothless rednecks that live on farms and chew tobacco? We know Oklahoma's got plenty of those, and, oddly enough, I don't see them at OU games. Could it be because they're in Stillwater rooting on their beloved Cowboys? I think so. You're the ag school, remember?
Furthermore, these must be some rich meth heads. OSU has to use gimmicks to sell season tickets. OU has to put up a rope for the waiting list.
Everybody loves a winner. You did get that right.
Most of OU's fan base are washed-up meth heads that abuse their wives? Do you really believe that? If you do, that is pretty sad. OU's not the ones having trouble selling tickets and resorting to schemes to try to bring in revenue from their rival's fans. Who sounds like the loser here. Most of the 85,000 plus fans in the stadium on Saturday are middle class or above. The meth-heads aren't there. I will say this, there wasn't reports of OU fans throwing bottles at apposing teams or cheering when another team's player got hurt. Also, I've been to many games at both places and heard the OSU fans cheer when it is announced that OU was losing. It still baffles me that OU fans actually cheer when it is announced that OSU is winning. Whose fans would sound classier to an outsider that knew this?
Wow, Ben, you're really getting somewhere. So, what you're saying (and, you're saying it "factually." Way to go!) is that, "Not all Sooners are meth-heads... but all meth-heads are Sooners." "Not all Sooners are wife beaters... but all wife beaters are Sooners." "Not all Sooners are white-trash... but most white trash Okies are Sooners." Is that what you are factually stating?
I'm sorry Grant, but a lot of of your fan base is white trash. We have some at OSU, but not as much as OU, because you guys win national championships. I am not saying you are a loser, I just meant to say that most of your fan base (ones who didn't attend the university) are probably washed up meth heads who abuse their wives. If you did a study in Oklahoma and asked all of the meth heads which school they would like better, I would guarantee you that more than 90% would say OU. It's a true fact Grant. Find an addict, a spousal abuser and ask them their college preference! And really, my fellow Oklahoman...there are actually poor people outside of Edmond who like OU and happen to smoke crack. They are the losers. Not the OU fans who post on this message board. Right?
Ben, Stillwater, OK 74074 - Jan 31, 2008 at 4:34 pm
thanks ben, may cooler heads prevail....and grant, but i ain't running for president or anything else (even if i might do a better job). i don't need the media scrutiny.
I am no attorney, bu tI wonder if there is not a legal action here based on anti-trust laws. If Holder said no single game tickets available to ANY game, it would seem fair. However, he is creating restraints on trade/commerce and reducing competition (in the market place of tickets) which are key elemts in antitrust laws.
Right Ben. Every OU fan you talk to is either too rich, too drug addicted, too "white trash" or too spousal-abusing. Every OU fan you meet, huh? There's something wrong with all of them that you just don't find at OSU, right? You made a terrific point there, brother. And, you sealed it with a "losers" for good measure. Please. You're a testament to exactly the point I was making. Thanks for your support.
otis good post!! good call, actually.
I love to hear constructive criticism rather than terrible comments about my university. thanks for the thoughts.
Ben, Stillwater, OK 74074 - Jan 31, 2008 at 4:07 pm
you guys miss the point. even osu fans that don't have or want or can use season tickets get screwed in this deal. it would make more sense if osu alums could buy tickets for the game. that would keep the ou fans out but let osu fans in. but as it is everyone that doesn't want to be forced to buy a season ticket for one game misses out. everyone here is just having to good a time jacking with each other. as always plenty of tickets will be available on ebay or wherever for a price. its just to bad there may be alot of empty seats. i would hope holder will work out something to give those seats to underprivledged youth or something rather than have them go to waste. sorry this post was serious. i'll work on it.
Grant-
You would have to admit that more white-trash people like OU than OSU, because they can be fans of something that is idolized in society and not have to focus on their pathetic narrow-minded white-trash lives. My point is, I really don't care about your scoreboard comment. Cause usually when an ignorant OU fan says it to me (not all OU fans are ignorant), they are either;
A. Driving a Mercedes/LandRover/SUV
B. Toothless
C. On Meth/Alcoholic
D. Abused their spouse at some point
I really think you guys might win the scoreboard comment in the game of football, but probably won't win scoreboard in the game of life. Losers.
Ben, Stillwater, OK 74074 - Jan 31, 2008 at 3:58 pm
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The prices she quotes for Iowa State are not actually seats. That price is for sitting on the grass on the hillside, general admission area with limited restroom and concession facilities. For an actual seat at an Iowa State game for 2008 the season ticket price is $350 for a 6 game home schedule. That works out to $58.33 per game.
You can get a season ticket for OSU for 2008 for $294 in the Family Fun Zone for a 7 game home schedule, which equates to $42 per ticket. Or if you want a better seat a season ticket will cost you $419, an average of $59.86 per ticket. Slighty above what ISU is charging, and for a team that has at least been to and won a bowl game the last 2 years versus ISU's 7-17 record the past 2 years.
Leave it to Jenni to once again not do her research and skew the facts. She is the worst excuse of a 'journalist' that I have ever had the displeasure of reading.
Furthermore, these must be some rich meth heads. OSU has to use gimmicks to sell season tickets. OU has to put up a rope for the waiting list.
Everybody loves a winner. You did get that right.
I love to hear constructive criticism rather than terrible comments about my university. thanks for the thoughts.
You would have to admit that more white-trash people like OU than OSU, because they can be fans of something that is idolized in society and not have to focus on their pathetic narrow-minded white-trash lives. My point is, I really don't care about your scoreboard comment. Cause usually when an ignorant OU fan says it to me (not all OU fans are ignorant), they are either;
A. Driving a Mercedes/LandRover/SUV
B. Toothless
C. On Meth/Alcoholic
D. Abused their spouse at some point
I really think you guys might win the scoreboard comment in the game of football, but probably won't win scoreboard in the game of life. Losers.