Letters to the editor: Monday, June 23, 2008

Published: June 23, 2008

Get rid of primary system
Primaries are the worst thing that's happened to the presidential elections. In order to get your party's nomination, you must appeal to the fringe element — the extremists. Then, in November, we're faced with the choice of the far left or the far right.

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Before the primaries, decisions were made in smoke-filled rooms of each party's convention. They tended to pick candidates from the middle. Doing away with these popularity contests within the party would give us a better choice in November.

Let's end the primaries and go back to the smoke-filled rooms! Need proof? Consider that in 2004 the choice was between George W. Bush and John Kerry.

Jim McGlynn, Oklahoma City

We deserve better
Regarding "Math problem: Petition process in need of change” (Our Views, June 15): Congratulations to The Oklahoman for speaking out against the awful loss of our voter initiative rights. Oklahoma voters deserve better than to get to vote on only two of the 23 initiatives submitted this decade.

We need to lower our signature requirement, which is the highest in the nation, and expand the narrow 90-day period for gathering those signatures. The latter reform is just as important as the former in giving grassroots efforts a chance to qualify a measure for the ballot; moreover, it doesn't require a constitutional amendment. Voters also need protection so that petitions aren't thrown out on technical grounds after hundreds of thousands of citizens have signed.

Reform won't be easy. During this year's legislative session, The Oklahoman rightly took Senate Democrats to task for blocking a bill that would have simply allowed a task force to study reform. It appears reform will have to be citizen-initiated. Oklahomans for Initiative Rights is launching a citizen task force to gather public comment and ideas for reform. We want to hear from you. Email us at ekco@swbell.net

Norma Sapp, Norman

Sapp is executive director of Oklahomans for Initiative Rights.

Changing times
I used to think that happiness was having a loving family, a nice home and nice friends. How things have changed! Happiness is now having a full tank of gasoline.

Woody Havens, Newcastle

Marxism lives on
In 1875, a lifetime failure proclaimed his philosophy of economic compassion and fairness, saying, "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.” The idea was popular among academics, even though in conflict with the biblical commandments against stealing and coveting another's property. It brought with it a new bigotry and enmity for religion. It created a class of cold, hardened people with no concept of love or spirituality; tens of millions of innocents were executed.

Lenin brought communism to Russia. Germany turned to Hitler's national socialist party. In the United States, arrogant intellectuals in our universities dismissed our Founding Fathers' beliefs in freedom, religion and morality, proclaiming them antiquated and ignorant. Our graduated income tax was created to equalize wealth and punish those who created it. In 1920, avowed Marxist Roger Baldwin founded the ACLU to embark upon a path of anti-Christian bigotry and unconstitutional suppression of religious speech and exercise.

Marxism lives on, even though it's a proven failure. Beware of any politician who advocates more taxes for the hated "rich” and limits on free expression, or who believes that religion is a desperate refuge of the ignorant.

Ronald Bouwman, Oklahoma City


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Wonder why Bush didn't resend the executive order on offshore drilling other day and just lay it on Congress
Robert, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 10:09 PM
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Chris , You seem to act like a clone of Lance. He accused me yesterday of spreading false rumors. But when I presented proof of my post by stateing names he did not respond
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 6:11 PM
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Chris, You are willing to spend your time on the board trying to insult me instead of trying to furnish proof of your words with facts and possibly some answers, That would really help your credibility. Now the reason I asked if you had viewed the Nissan trucks in Honduras on line was to see if you could actually use one of them in your work as a contractor. I do believe some of them will get 40 MPG or more but so will a motorcycle.
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 6:10 PM
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Bert you know everything. I concede you are the smartest man in the world. Your spelling and use of the English language don't matter, you are still the smartest man on these boards.
Chris, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 6:03 PM
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Chris, and I do not really disagree with you on your assesment of Bush. What scares me is that as bad as he is I feel either Gore or Kerry would have been worse
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 5:35 PM
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Jim. Jeffs comment was not just plain dumb. It is the truth
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 5:34 PM
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Chris, you need to get your facts straight , I did not call your friend liars. I asked ypou what the model number of the Nissan pickup in Honduras was. You did not answer. I asked you if you had tried to import one. again you did not answer. I asked you if you had tried to have the local Nissan dealer import one for you. Again you guessed it. No answer from you. i asked you if you had went online and checked out the Nissan pickups in Honduras. again no answer. All you could do was accuse me of calling your friends liars. And then you reduce yourse4lf to worrying about my spelling, grammar and puntuations. How sad. Now try if you will to answer or at least post facts to support your words. And again I will tell you I have imported things into several countries so I know it can be done.
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 5:33 PM
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Jeff, that is just plain dumb.
Jim, Bethany - Jun 23, 2008 4:58 PM
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The Goal of socialism is communism. We can assist America giving them small doses of socialism until one day they awake under communism.
jeff, Harrah - Jun 23, 2008 4:56 PM
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Im reminded of the movie The Mummy where the mindless morons just walk blindly murmuring "Imhotep" - instead of Imhotep, today we get Obama.
Robert, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 3:40 PM
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Jeff I agreed with Desiderius on ONE thing out of the thousands of posts he's made here. Bert called me and a friend of mine a liar and won't back off of it so I really don't give a rip what you think about it. And over the last few months this paper HAS printed some letters to the editor that everyone knew weren't opinion or facts, just falsehoods. Opinions are one thing but printing people spouting lies is another. And for your info as I've stated here several times I plan to vote for McCain over Obama because Obama is way too far left for me. And George W. Bush is the worst President we've had since Jimmy Carter, maybe actually worse.
Chris, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 1:19 PM
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http://www.langston.com/Fun_People/1995/1995AYZ.html

Jim, Bethany - Jun 23, 2008 12:54 PM
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People often attribute the quote to Lenin but there is no evidence that he ever used it.
Jay, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 12:40 PM
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Chris, Bert is not a liar. You agree with desiderious shows exactly how much sense you have have. I used to think Lance had more substance to his post long time ago, now it"s a stupid paper, everyone is else is dumb. Because bert is a conservative you disagree and that is the only reason. Same with Bush since Bush is in charge the liberals disagree and just like what Lenin said about Hollywood and Liberals, "they are useful idiots" .
jeff, Harrah - Jun 23, 2008 11:41 AM
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Bouwman needs to get his facts straight. It is the right wing that is the desperate refuge for the ignorant! Their idea of bigotry is anyone who does not agree that Christianity should be shoved down our throats. He has the relgious tolerance of a Islamic terrorist.
Jim, Bethany - Jun 23, 2008 11:39 AM
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Robert just described most of the conservatives who post to this board. So, it must be a case of generally stupid people, and not the political ideas they espouse.
Don, oklahoma city - Jun 23, 2008 11:35 AM
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To Liberals its not results that count - its the thought, no matter how ridiculous, no matter how many times it fails, no matter how much is lost, no matter how much it costs all Americans. To oppose for the sake of opposition with no common sense plan or thought out alternative, is asinine.
Robert, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 10:58 AM
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I agree with Desiderius. And Bert says Lance doesn't have a mind, though his posts are always articulate, thoughtful, and SPELLED and PUNCTUATED correctly.
Chris, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 10:11 AM
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The legislature doesn't want the Initiative Petition process to be sensible, because it would unwind the legislative morality that they have imposed upon us.
Kevin, Shawnee - Jun 23, 2008 9:07 AM
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Bouwman is (or was) employed in the editorial department at Opubco. It amusing to me that the DOK takes great pains to label the origin of the letter writers (see Norma Sapp's letter today), but doesn't bother to let the average reader know where his letters originate.
Don, oklahoma city - Jun 23, 2008 8:40 AM
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My goodness, seems like some people have a whole lot of time on their hands. Your first clue to something being amiss is the existence of the Daily Disappointment.
Terri, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 8:12 AM
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Bert: you are a liar of the highest degree. Your conservative slants are nothing but hot air. You bash Lance but don't answer the crux of his comments. If Obama is socialist then Bush is a nazi! Shall we banter on - ?
Desiderius, Tuttle - Jun 23, 2008 8:04 AM
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jerry. Are you saying that Lance has a mind?
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 7:38 AM
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Bert, quit asking Lance those hard questions. He has enough on his mind trying to convince the rest of the world that only HE is right!
Jerry, Moore - Jun 23, 2008 7:27 AM
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Ronald Bouwman is a right wing religious nut.
Randy, Oklahoma City - Jun 23, 2008 7:04 AM
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Lance, as far as I am concerned if a person believes completely different than you believe then that person believes the truth. Obama is a socialist. Now did you read my answer to you in yesterdays posts when you accused me of spreading falsehoods? If you did why no response? Is it because you cannot respond to the truth?
BERT, HENRYETTA - Jun 23, 2008 6:54 AM
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Leaving his conflation of a variety of totalitarian political systems under the rubric of a single economic theory, what I love about Bouwman's letter is his assertion that taxes are unbiblical, violating the commandments against stealing and coveting. Wow. That's some creative scriptural construction. The guy clearly lives in the "echo chamber" of his own brilliance.
Stephen, Ada - Jun 23, 2008 6:32 AM
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Another couched assertion that Obama is a socialist. And this one from the Oklahoman's favorite letter-writer and amateur historian Ronald Bouwman! They publish this guy about once a month, and just about each letter offers a mangled history lesson (for instance, Roger Baldwin wasn't an "avowed Marxist") and concludes with the implication that Democrats are really socialists. If his are the best letters this paper gets, no wonder they run so many of his letters (he's been published about once a month)!
Lance, From OK, now in Upstate New York - Jun 23, 2008 5:41 AM
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