So an OKC business man comes to Seattle and buys our team one day, with the hidden agenda of moving the "Seattle Super Sonics" to Oklahoma City which he initially denied to the people of Washington. Which seeing how it didn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out why a business man and his group from the OKC would come all the way to Seattle to buy an NBA franchise, when the city there from wants and doesn't even have their own NBA team. Which seeing how the inevitable fate has occurred, and the Sonics indeed will probably be moving because the citizens of Seattle the nation's 14th largest sales market, weren't stupid enough to fund an arena project with their hard earned tax dollars for an NBA team that due to the new ownership has been destined to leave for Oklahoma City since the beginning. Gee who would of thought Clay “Let’s lie to the people of Seattle about wanting to move the Sonics” Bennett would ever wana move the team, ha ha me and the rest of Washington State never saw that coming lol! Bennett knew Seattle never trusted him about keeping the team here, and so Key Arena has always been a perfect loophole for him to up and move the team. Seeing how the Sonics have an NBA Championship and over 41 years of history that is in-grained in our city of Seattle, how exactly has Seattle not supported the Sonics? By again not voting to upgrade an arena for a team that has been destined to move since Bennett bought them? By not going to games knowing that the owners could care less that they did, because regardless of that 41 year history the Sonics have in the city of Seattle, or the people who have had season tickets most of their lives, this will probably be the last season the franchise resides here? Seattle loves the Sonics, and that’s why you find so many pissed off residents that live here like myself venting their frustration about the issue. So for anyone to say we’ve never supported the Sonics or any team from here for that matter, you need to rely on other sources then Clay Bennett for your information lol.

Rob says, "please Jill, give me one of example how seattle has failed to `support` it`s team." Rob, I do not ever recall saying Seattle has failed to support it's team. If I did, I apologize. I'm pretty sure I've been on record from day one that this is not about Seattle not supporting it's team. I personally think Seattle has been a great home for the Sonics, and it is my last choice for a team for that reason. I've been a huge proponent for an expansion team and the Hornets as a second choice, were expansion not an option. At this point in time, it looks as if David Stern has ignored my interest in an expansion team or the Hornets. I'll not be a liar and say I'd rather have no team at all than the Sonics....I'm not that noble, unfortunately. But you'll never find me saying Seattle has not supported the Sonics, except financially with this arena issue. And Larry, if we get a team, I owe you a game. I'm not here to gloat. I understand not everyone thinks the same as I do. I do think you'll find the time flies by and the sales tax will be over and done with before you know it. We also need to educate everyone who qualifies for the sales tax rebate that it exists. There's no need for lower income residents or the elderly on a fixed income paying this tax.

And to you boys in Seattle. Get over it! You didn't support your team.
we did`nt?bull, weve supported the sonics for over fourty years. were on our fourth venue,and thats on it`s second upgrade.clay bought the team under false pretences,and has NEVER negotiated in good faith. please Jill, give me one of example how seattle has failed to `support` it`s team. i find it somewhat sad that the only way you people can find to validate city pride is to steal something from another city,but thats not suprising coming from a state whos motto glorifies cheaters

Congratulations on your victory (Jill, Philip/Bug, Michael, Jenifer and everyone else who voted Yes). We will never know if I was right (about getting an NBA team if the vote failed)... But we will watch and see how the other things play out.

So far so good on the vote....58% yes 42% no.
Lets keep it going.

You PRO ARENA UPGRADE folk confuse bigger with better. As if personal quality of life depends on a massive city in which to live. It's just the opposite, if you don't have the resources and infrastructure to support truly urban living. OKC won't be in that shape for a couple of decades - if ever - and I'll give you about 2 years in Dallas-type traffic jams to fully regret your thinking today. Be careful of what you wish for.

Jill wrote: "No, we didn't have enough money to make a nicer Ford Center six years ago. It was the last thing built with MAPS and we were out of money." You keep forgetting, we "extended" the sales tax for another 6 months to, as the campaign was called, "finish MAPS right." To date I haven't found or has anyone produced even ONE article written at the time that supports the contention the Ford was built "scaled back" "bare bones" or "on the cheap". The only articles that are saying that are ones written in the past few months (revisionist history?)

Jose wrote: "Bobby you idiot the renovations will keep OKC from having to build a new arena for another 15-20 years." Would love that if it was true (buildings SHOULD last for DECADES, not years). But the Mayor has said it will only be 10 to 15 years. But don't know why he thinks that when the current state-of-the art Ford only lasted 5 years. Why would a "like new" state-of-the-art Ford last 10 to 15? [sorry to those that hate the state-of-the-art phrase but that is our City leaders calling it that, not me]

Good luck to us! I hope our voters have the good sense to vote to bring a team here and continue our progress. I don't want to be another Omaha. Of course Omaha has a $300 million arena complex, so we won't even be on it's level if this doesn't pass.

Mr. B says, "So only 6 years later the Ford Center is a crappy center according to those who support the tax." No, we didn't have enough money to make a nicer Ford Center six years ago. It was the last thing built with MAPS and we were out of money. It's like someone only having a certain amount of money to spend on a house, and so perhaps they can't buy quite as nice a house as they'd like. But, a few years later, they might be able to add some nicer features. Maybe they build a swimming pool and fix up the kitchen. That doesn't mean the swimming pool and kitchen will have to be fixed up again in six years. It just means the house wasn't where the couple wanted it to be when they bought it.

It IS generous of them. It's quite clear that it's not money. They've owned the Sonics for two seasons now and have lost money both years. The only owners who've even gone to a game are Clay Bennett, and I think the First Fidelity guy (forgot this name, but I saw an article in the paper saying he'd gone to a game in Houston or somewhere). If they're not making money and they're not going to games, what reason do you think they have for buying the team? So they can bring it here and "line their pockets"? To even make a 5% return on all the money they've invested (which is about what you could get on a CD), they'd have to make $25 million dollars a year. There aren't many NBA teams that make that kind of money, and most of them are in big cities. So, what conclusion should I come to? 1. They like losing money 2. They like having a team but don't want to go to the games or 3. They wanted to bring a team to Oklahoma City? Number three makes the most sense, but not because they're going to make any reasonable money here. Most likely they won't. The only conclusion I can come to is that they want Oklahoma City to have a team. They've all done other good things for Oklahoma City as philanthropists and civic leaders. Why do people have so much trouble believing this might be philanthropy as well?

Actually Jose, the Ford Center was completed in 2002, so its been 6 years. Does this mean a constant investment of 120 million every 6 years? So only 6 years later the Ford Center is a crappy center according to those who support the tax.

No Jimmy Boy the ownership group observed what a great atmosphere had been created inside the Ford Center when we all finally had one team to cheer for. That's why they wanted to bring the NBA here, cause that excitement was contagious.

Bobby you idiot the renovations will keep OKC from having to build a new arena for another 15-20 years.

Hey Jill - so, the ownership group observed all of our happy faces at the Hornets games, and wants to bring all that happiness back for us? Really? How generous of them.

I voted NO today and my 5 friends also voted NO. We shouldn't have to pay millions to upgrade the Ford Center when in 5 years we will have to spend more millions to build another arena.

YOU PEOPLE ARE IDIOTS...SOME of the reponses on here sound like Oklahoma City will fall off the face of the earth, become the worst city in America, no busineses will come, thier children will suffer, ect... COME ON Oklahoma City is a GREAT place to live no matter what happens. I enjoy bricktown, staying at the Skirvin, more hotels are being built, not because of the Hornets/Sonics but because OKC is doing alright. I enjoy OKC today and have enjoyed it for the past 20 years.

Seattle has supported the sonics. You must have gotten your information from bennett. That guy is a joke. He will rip the tax payers of okc off if he can. Seattle does not trust him because he has done nothing but lie to us. Wait until the arena doesn't do what he wants it to do. HE WILL do the same to you as he has done to us. The fight in seattle is just beginning. You may end up with another team, and if you do, cross your fingers clay bennett isn't involved.

And to you boys in Seattle. Get over it! You didn't support your team, so they are leaving. Whether or not they are coming to OKC is moot. They aren't staying there. You obviously care A LOT to bother to come lurking on the DO site. Blogsters..please. I always get a kick out of people who have never left their nest and how they are so "worldly". Get out and see some different places. We have a great quality of life down here. That's the big secret. Even the basketball players themselves admitting to being surprised how nice it was here. Educate yourself and move forward.

To Eudell in VA Beach. It's obvious that you've been gone given your commentary. When you visit , you must just stay near relatives and not get out much. Having been here since my days in the Air Force in the mid-80's, I can tell you that there is barely any resemblance of OKC now versus then. You need to be more informed. In regards to attendance and New Orleans "success", look at these FACTS: Attendance, year, rank/number of teams. 2002-2003, 19/29, 2003-2004, 28/29, 2004-2005, 30/30, 2005-2006 (IN OKC), 11/30, 2006-2007 (OKC with several games in NO, which hurt attendance), 15/30, 2007-2008 (this year when they are a great team and back in NO), 27/30. Hmm... constantly at or near the bottom in NO. In the upper 1/3 in okc. Who isn't ready?

Kieran, UPS is headquartered in Atlanta. Hey Gary, tell your babysitter to let you get more fresh air outside. You are starting to sound like a 3 yr. old.

It would be nice if Seattle got to keep there team and Oklahoma City could start a new franchise.

OKC is in the middle of nowhere. The rest of the country knows you for one thing and that is the bombing. I'm sorry to say but yes OKC would be better off with a sports team but that won't change your image to the rest fo the country. No says "hey OKC has awesome whatever lets go vacation there!" You should increase the tax and spend that money on attractions and the city. Lets say the Seattle Crappy Sonics come to OKC. Do you think they will ever win a championship? I don't because they have to first re-vamp the team which takes 3 years then get talent and OK for poo and giggle lets say they do win the championship. How much money, positive perspective, and general good karma will that bring to the city? Not much. Clay Bennett will sell you on " we need a world class NBA team and the sonics are it" only because he will make a fortune on the Sonics. Clay is what? An engineer? No A philanthropist? hell no, a social worker? No try again a politician? no but close. He is a business man!!! He makes money he doesn't make cities better, he doesn't donate the majority of his time and money to charity, and he only cares about OKC because he is a smart businessman and sees that he will make boookkkuuuuu bucks with buying the sonics. How will he make this? From the tax payers of course!!! Bottom line vote no, get something on the ballot that will help the city not make a rich man even richer.

Oh BTW I live in Seattle and hate the Sonics. You guys can have them because we, the residents of Seattle fell for the whole raise taxes to get/keep a sports team. We call it the Seattle Coliseum which is now Key Arena and we pay through the nose in taxes. for what? a lousy team that we pay for and now a is going to move onto a new city. Here are the basic instructions for the sonics: Suck, blame on facility, tax residents to make more $, take money, move on. Repeat as necessary to pillage city. Reminds me of the Simpsons episode of " Monorail, monorail, Shelbyville has a monorail Springfield needs one too!!" (Oh did I mention Seattle has a Monorail? don't get me started on that!!)

I've been away from OKC for about 26 years, although I visit at least once a year. The city, with the exception of Brick Town, and a few other spots doesn't seem to change. There isn't much diversity at all, it's almost like the city is 30 years behind. While it may be a inexpensive place to live there is absolutely nothing captivating about the city. I think ultimately this will affect an NBA Team if it does happen. New Orleans was supported pretty well, but they succeeded. Could you imagine a team playing in downtown Oklahoma City unsuccessfully for a couple of years straight. Then they will be "those arrogant, underachieving and overpaid" thugs. Face it OKC isn't ready.

Here's a quote from ESPN today regarding the vote: "If that measure fails, experts on both sides of the issue suspect Oklahoma City will not get an NBA team any time soon." A NO vote means NO NBA.

OKC is a great place to live...I say we make it even better by getting an NBA team in here. I travel for a living and have been lots of cool places but it does seem to me that the most happening places are the places with MAJOR SPORTS TEAMS. They are a point of pride and good things tend to gravitate to them. My point is, its not like they are adding one penny on to what we already pay, the MAPS for kids penny sales tax runs out in January of 2009, this penny sales tax starts after that, so essentially they are EXTENDING the current penny sales tax for 15 months. Its not like we don't already pay it. Its great for the city and the future benefits far outweigh any penny tax extension we have to pay now. I agree with the person who said its our arena...the city owns it so I can understand us having to pay for it.

I think a lot of us would rather have an expansion team or the Hornets than the Sonics. To be honest, this vote isn't about getting the Sonics, it's about getting A team and fixing up a subpar arena that's going to need it anyway to be competitive with (and this is the embarrassing part) Omaha, Tulsa, Wichita. It's pretty bad when you're just trying to get up to the level of some other small midwestern cities. You in Seattle just want local ownership, and we just want a team, although local ownership would be nice. We're ready to step up and become an NBA worthy city, that's all.

For all of you that think seattle is a bunch of coffee drinking grungers. Think again! The same thing can be said about your town( a bunck of redneck idiots)Is that everyone in okc. Probably not. Don't think for a second that we don't support the sonics. When clay bennett bought the sonics what do you think was going through our heads. He way over paid for the franchise. He asked us to pay over 500 million dollars to build a new arena. He was late with his proposal and would not budge. After that he got rid of every sonic legend, and alienated the fan base. Our local radio sports radio station is aloud 1 sonic player a week. I and hundreds of thousands of the SEATTLE SUPERSONICS fans do not want this team to leave. We have offered more money to put a face lift on our arena than you are voting on. In a prime location in down town seattle. The issue was never about the sonics in seattle, but how fast can we get them out of town. Howard schultz is a putz, and the butt of every joke in seattle. The previous owner would not have sold the team to that jerk if he knew he would sell to outside seattle ownership. Because you in okc don't have a professional team, look at it like losing the sooners. Look at it from our prospective. We don't want to lose our team, it just seems like noone wants to hear us the seattle sports fan anymore. Clay bennett dosen't want to negotiate anymore, and david stern doesn't have a clue how to run the NBA anymore.

Gary says, "I just got back from voting no. Felt good to stick it to the rich man." Ya know Gary, you were actually sticking it to our city. The "rich man" will probably be better off financially in another city like Kansas City, Las Vegas or Louisville if this doesn't pass. You're not hurting the owners at all, except for the fact that they would love to bring a team to their home. You just voted against momentum and progress for this city, voted against revitalizing our downtown and, if this doesn't pass, we'll be fixing up the Ford Center in a few years anyway,and probably spending more, but there will be no NBA team for our city. Once Omaha, Tulsa and Kansas City start competing for and getting the Big Twelve championship and NCAA regionals, once the good concerts start going to Tulsa, Wichita and Omaha, we'll have to fix it up to compete. The Police are going to be at Omaha's $300 million arena complex this summer, but not in our $89 million building.

I just voted YES. I'm glad I won't see Gary at any NBA games.

I just got back from voting no. Felt good to stick it to the rich man - nyaaaah!!!

Rob, maybe you and the rest of the self righteous, latte drinking, Nirvana worshiping citizens of Seattle should have actually gone and supported "your" team over the past 10 years. If you had maybe the previous owner wouldn't have been so desperate to give away a team to an ownership group that made it clear what they wanted and what the consequences would be if they didn't get what they wanted. Don’t cry foul play now that you realize that people are starting to see that the market of little ole Oklahoma City is more attractive than big bad Seattle.

treating them no better than they're being treated up in Seattle. We should be ashamed of ourselves.
Jill, Oklahoma City - Mar 4, 2008 8:13 AM
seattle treating clay and the boys shabbily?pullesse jill it`s the other way around.up here in seattle bennett promised a good faith effort to keep the sonics in town,instead he`s done nothing but lie and try to weasle his way out of town.
his proposed`arena` deal was phony.he came in at the end of the legislative session with pretty pictures and try`ed to get 500 million for an arena on land he did`nt own ,didnt have an option on, in fact he never even talked to the property owners who had development plans of their own.when it was of course rejected he threw up his hands and declared he was out of ideas and was forced to move the team,which was his idea all along(ask mccleandon)
theres plenty of proposals up here for either a new arena or a refurbished key arena,but clay dos`nt want to discuss it. he refuses to meet with local groups(pullaylup tribe has a deal on the table)he`s doing what he`s done since day one ,nothing. so whos treating who badly?

Wow, some odd commentary. In regards to mass transit--get real. We don't have traffic problems. At all. Go to any other metro near OKC's size and then complain about our traffic again. As if. In regards to the "it's not an investment/bigger isn't better" folks. Yes both are. If you don't invest in event infrastructure, quality of life events will not come here. In order to keep and enhance the great quality of life we currently enjoy here, we need to keep moving forward. Bigger is better when it comes to quality of life events as well. A city has to reach a critical mass to entice these things to be a part of it. Further, this is another chance to start/continue the enhancement of OKC as a corporate friendly city. With hope, not only will we keep our large energy corporations, but one day entice some to come home/relocate here. Corporations take a very hard look at quality of life issues. OKC is moving forward folks. Stop being so parochial.

Bring team to a new city. City pays for an arena. City loves the owners, sells out the arena. Owner does some charitable work in the city (building Little League ballfields, etc.).


After 10 years, owners want another arena. Sports media talks it up as "good for everyone."


City government asks "why finance an arena for billionaires when we're struggling to deliver basic services?"


Owner and sports media hang city government in effigy.


Owner threatens to move.


NBA commissioner comes in to "mediate" the issue, in reality, adding his efforts to shake down the city.


Deadlines are set by which things need to happen. They don't.


Fans try to save the team and fail.


Team leaves for another city.


Repeat steps 1-9 in new location

I for one don't think this will pass, even though it should. Not enough was done to ensure the voters that they would get a return on their envestment. I live in OKC and voted "yes" this morning but there were not a lot of people there that looked like they did the same. OKC for the most part is populated by poorer low class families. They are saying it is not fair for them to have to foot the bill while the people of Edmond, Norman, Midwest City, Yukon, and Moore pay nothing for it but will enjoy it more than they will. This either should have been a state wide vote or a county vote, not limitted to just the residence of OKC. The Mayor says this will transform the downtown economy. That is great but what about the south side or around the Village and Warr Acres. Those places are in need it more than downtown. I have not driven on the south side of OKC in years for fear of being robbed or shot. I voted yes because I want the NBA but understand why some will vote no. This was not very well handled by the Mayor and his team.

Props to Kieran in Everett. He's about the only on these boards who gets it AND speaks civil about this.

As a native Sooner from OKC who has lived in Seattle for many years, I am of the opinion both towns deserve their NBA teams and the best solution is for the Sonics to stay and OKC to get another team in the next few years.

Check out the link below from ESPN's Bill Simmons who has no skin in the game and nails the issue on the head.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/080229&sportCat=nba

This isn't a vote on whether Oklahoma City wants the Sonics. If the Sonics aren't a high quality NBA team, let them stay in Seattle and have OKC lure another team here with our updated arena. I would vote yes if I could (unfortunately I live in Norman).

Hey Carson, sorry I didn't dumb it down for you but I'll try here: when I said I didn't have an opinion that was as to whether it was something OKC should vote for or against. I did, however, offer an example of studies done on whether these taxpayer arenas are good for cities. I then offered an opinion on whether you will read that in this paper. Got it now?
And please no more comments about my bulge. I'm not your type.

Best post yet is James at 7:11 A.M. Perfect!

RE: A bigger and better city... Been to Dallas, Atlanta, New York, Miami, LA, Seattle, lately? Do you want that? Is there something wrong with OKC remaining a livable city? Are our traffic jams not big enough? Is our violent crime not vast enough? Do our streets not have enough potholes? Do we not have plenty of restaurants, shopping, concerts, sporting events, etc? Is Bigger really Better? NOT to me.

Jose, the city council refused to let it go to vote you stupid moron. We can't vote on something that special interests group have captive. But they sure want us to pass this special interest item that will NOT improve Oklahoma City's living status.

Hello Oklahomans!!! Wow! Where do I start? As you know the Sonics have been part of our community for 41 years and have had some recent problems in obtaining a new/refurbished arena for Mr. Bennett or even Mr. Schultz the previous owner. The need is because of a bad lease and bad NBA economics and an arena that was built too small for current NBA standards. Both ownerships have been upset at the city's hardline on financing such a project. Mr. Shultz (STARBUCKS BILLIONARE) wanted to contribute 20 million towards a 250 million dollar renovation and have us who drink his coffee pay the rest. The city said no. That should be understandable. Mr. Bennett talked the talk, but has failed to walk the walk. When he purchased the teams, yes teams he said that in good faith he wanted to keep the teams here where they BELONG. He wanted to build a $500 million dollar palace for the teams and have it financed in 12 months without a certain dollar amount from ownership before hand. Anyone in a city that has built a new sports facility has taken years in planning and finacing for anything to actually be built. 12 months is destined to fail. That's what Mr. Bennett wanted. There is his out. He tried. Now he can pursue other avenues. He for some reason didn't want a $350 million dollar renovation to the existing building. All this in the 12th largest market in the US. Microsoft,Boeing,Starbucks,UPS,Paccar and many other fortune 500 companies located in this bustling city of ours. Oooops I heard something, that was Mr. McClendon letting the cat out of the bag. They never intended to keep the Sonics here in the first place. He said their intention was to move the teams all along. Maybe the city of Seattle saw through the BS and called them on it???? Mr. Bennett didn't want a $300 million dollar refirbishment of Key Arena and it could definately work for the city and the ownership group, but it wont because he never wanted to stay in the first place. Dishonesty doesn't go very far. We here in Seattle intend to fight for what is ours. We have our lawsuit designed to hold the Sonics to the lease. Then step two is to have a local owner buy the team and believe me they're ready. FACT! The city is currently working on a package of $350 million dollars to renovate Key Arena for the SONICS. I know you have a vote today for a $120 million dollar RENOVATION of the 6 year old Ford Center. Hmmmm. That seems a bit two-faced! Why wouldn't the ownership group put up half the money? Or all of it since they have it anyway. If sports teams are part of a PUBLIC TRUST between the city,fans and owners why are owners asking for the puplic to pay for their moneymaking areans. Mr. Bennett is a smart man, I have no doubts about that. I think he underestimated this whole process a little and never gave us here in Seattle that GOOD FAITH effort he promised from day one. You can archive that and hear the press conference for yourself. I'm not saying Oklahoma City doesn't deserve a chance at the NBA. What you did for the Hornets was great!! You don't derserve our team and we don't deserve to lose them. I believe you will get an NBA team, but sadly I think it will be the Hornets after the 2008-09 season when they can OPT out of their lease because of the lack of attendence in New Orleans now that the population is less than before and money to spend isn't enough to support 2 pro teams. Mr. Bennett will sell the Sonics to local ownership and buy the Hornets form Mr. Shinn (he has already stated he wants to sell the Hornets to Mr. Bennett), and will move THEM to Oklahoma City and everyone will be happy! David Stern and the league will be embarrassed by the situation and the miss-handling of the Sonics and the disrespect to the fans of the Sonics for 41 YEARS and will reward Mr. Bennett for his loyalty and perserverance with the Hornets as a consolation prize. You have to be honest in any business venture. You will be exposed if your not. Be genuine and respectful of your customers. You find out how loyal Mr. Bennett will be 10 years after the Ford Center's renovation when he asks for a new arena because the current facility is not up to current standards and needs it to survive in the NBA long term. Will you be willing to pay for his $500 million dollar palace?? Think about it before you respond. You all know deep down that is a realistic possibility and probably will happen in the next 10 years. I hope Mr Bennett or whoever owns your NBA franchise understands that and respects the citizens of OKC to NOT ask you to pay for it! I hope Mr. Bennett has and will learn from his mistakes and will treat his home town better than he did Seattle. You've shown you can support a professional team short term. I think you can support one long term as well. In 2-4 years we will look back on all this and see through all the fog and the mess this has created. Enjoy supporting a long marriage between Oklahoma City and the Oklahoma Hornets or the Oklahoma Outlaws and we here in Seattle will CONTINUE to support OUR SEATTLE SUPERSONICS (named after a Boeing jet..a SEATTLE company) now and in the long and exciting future. See you in the 2013 Western Conference finals....Game 1 Oklahoma @ Seattle.

Richard, the mass transit system is not up for a vote today. SO SHUT UP! When and if the mass transit or light rail system vote comes up I'm sure alot of people will be for it. I sure will be, just like I am for everything else that will help OKC grow and become more attractive. So until then chill out and VOTE YES today.

Big money is behind this boondoggle. Hopefully the little guy will vote this thing down.

Dear Richard Idiot, Mass Transit will only come with polulation density downtown. the NBA will further spark downtown development and housing, not to mention make OKC more attractive to jobs. When there is sufficient density downtown, then mass transit can be built. Time to get off your one-issue caboose and realize that the proverbial horse does indeed, have to go before the cart.

Dear vote 'yes' idiots since I've seen that word thrown around quite a bit. The only way to be big league is to be it. So save Union Station for mass transit so people can get to your beloved Ford shrine. Otherwise it's just a joke. Why have an NBA team when you have to fight traffic to get there? Just a name doesn't make you 'big league'. Instead it's 'big laugh'. I would say people's priorities are misguided here. Mass transit helps everybody get to work and to enjoy sports. I've heard every excuse not to have mass transit here but that's why Oklahoma will always remain last in everything. Even after we get an NBA team.

"I am embarassed for the owners group that didn't factor in the improvements for the Ford Center when they decided to buy the team in the 1st place. They didn't do their due-diligence very well; or.., did they?"

Let's examine this statement and put it in terms that the "Vote No" idiots might understand...

If you are renting an apartment do you jump in and make improvements to it for the owner? Do you add a second bathroom and recarpet the floor? No, you allow your landlord to do so as the apartment is their property.

The Ford Center is and always will be the property of the City of Oklahoma City therefore the property of the taxpayers who paid for it. If we want to improve the tenants who use OUR property we may have to make an investment of our own money to lure better tenants.

I will vote yes on this and plan to vote yes for MAPS 3 and every MAPS program in the future. When a $300 million investment of public money results in a nearly $3 billion investment of private money, I say money well spent. The City has a proven track record of spending our money wisely and to our great benefit.

Hey Steve, that sure sounded and looked (bulging paragraph) like an opinion. I will be honest and say I have an opinion: Tulsans are content to have a nice yard and go shop at Utica, but that 2020 plans sounds like a humdinger!!!!

Vote Yes! It is good for the city and state. The team pays the city rent for practice facilites and the Ford Center. Not anyone can deny what maps has done for the city. This will have the same positive impact.

The city of Seattle still has Clay Bennett's barrel marks on the sides of the temple when he attempted to hold us hostage. We voted and paid for a 74.5 million renovation in 1994 (and still paying for it). This was done to keep the Sonics happy. Your bloggers are correct.... this is a bunch of millionaires who prefer to play on OKC tab. If I lived in OKC I would vote no... just like I did in Seattle.

I'm heading out at lunch time to go vote NO and send a resounding message to the filthy rich to keep their hands out of the citizens pockets!!

I don't have an opinion either way since I don't live in OKC and will only pay the tax while visiting, but I would like to point out that numerous studies, including one at Illinois, have shown that when cities build or fix up these arenas for wealthy owners, it doesn't really benefit the city; the money is just moved around from other areas. I think it's funny that Jill is defending the owners. She seems a little too informed on this issue (perhaps a PR flack?) but I do remember the Gaylords made a bunch of money on the naming rights for the Bricktown Ballpark, even though the taxpayers footed the bill. They found a way to make money on that; it wouldn't surprise me if they've got some under the table deals in the works here too. One thing's for certain, you won't read about it in this paper just like you won't read the facts about how taxpayer funded arenas and stadiums cost the cities money.

For those of you that talk about the NBA's "horrible image", can you tell me one bad thing that happened in OKC in the two years the Hornets were here that was directly attributable to the presence of the NBA?

Jill-No doubt it's a competition thing between OKC and Tulsa, but these people are obviously too short-sighted to see the other side of the issue. If they live outside the OKC metro and don't spend money here, they could have professional sports in our state and it would cost them nothing. Even if they don't care about the sport itself, I just think it brings an overall better image and reflects well on the entire state, not just OKC.

I would have to agree with Tom, Jill. You are missing the point; Let them complete their deal by funding the improvements themselves. There is no denying that NBA basketball would be a great benefit; but it is the principle of the thing. This is the wrong way to go about it. Impatience costs a lot of money.

"Why would someone that doesn't even live in OKC, especially someone from say Tulsa, NOT be in favor of the tax?" I can think of a couple of reasons. First of all, there are people in Tulsa who don't want to see Oklahoma City get anything they don't have or get ahead. And they've got a new arena that cost them $200 million. If we improve our arena, it will be comparable or better, and we're more centrally located. What I'm worried about if we dont' improve our arena....OKC losing concerts and athletic events to Tulsa....they would suddenly have to worry about if we bring ours up to standard.

Tom says, "Jill: If it is such a losing proposition then why do it?" That's why I've been trying to tell you. This group of people is doing this for our city. Like they done many times before. Why would McClendon say they'd be happy if they could break even? How about because it's the truth? Because they see this as a positive thing for Oklahoma City, and most of this ownership group has spent their adult life trying to improve Oklahoma City? Would that be a good enough reason? Can't we appreciate that people might do something for the good of their city without expecting a lot in return? Are we so cynical? If the city grows and prospers, it's good for all businessmen. It's good for our schools. It improves our property tax base, which helps improve city infrastructure. That's why.

K-Good, I hope you are one of them since you appear to be be voting YES. Thanks!

I'll be off tomorrow. At least on this topic. I post on any articles that affect OKC that are important to me. If you're from New Orleans, it really doesn't matter, does it?

hey Jill, Enough!!! I thought i was a big loser blogging from new orleans on this site... any shot you could stay off this site for a week or 2? if you want to have a conversation with someone, call them...ah, get a life? Jill and Larry. What a nightmare.

There are a lot of area in Edmond that have OKC utilities and are able to Vote YES today.

This is our ONE chance people.
------------------------------- Don't even think of believing the NO voters. One day, your children will wonder what you did to make our city, their home, a better place. Don't let the answer be 'Nothing'. How about 'I voted Yes,the NBA came, fans stepped up, downtown was vibrant, corporations took notice, brought companies, more employees, homes were built, schools improved, and we became a Big League City!' Vote YES!

Otherwise, we'll always be known as a small time middle of the country, nothing to do here state.
------------------------------------
Bill, if you were offered a team in Tulsa, you'd be first in line. Get real. Jeff, no NHL, but look what we got instead .. hello? Crime?? What Hornet's game did you go to? We went to nearly every one and had ZERO problems each and every time. Tons of family fun, spent money in all the Bricktown establishments and the entire family had something to look forward to (for a change).

Vote YES!

Jill: If it is such a losing proposition then why do it? These guys are not morons; they have made a lot of money in business; they know business. Bringing an NBA team to OKC must not be a business decision; then what is it?

This is not a question of good philanthropy or who the group is. It is a matter of a private enterprise going to the well for PUBLIC funding for a private venture. Once again, a penny here and a penny there and after a while you have a huge amount of money.

I am embarassed for the owners group that didn't factor in the improvements for the Ford Center when they decided to buy the team in the 1st place. They didn't do their due-diligence very well; or.., did they? It is hard to deny the intensity of this vote. It looks more like a last-ditch desperation move by the mayors on behalf of an owners group who did not make a very good business decision.

It will be interesting to see if this message board is any reflection on how the actual vote goes today. By my count, if you count me in the YES votes, it is currently 8-6 (57%) in favor of the YES vote so far on this board. But if you look closer, an interesting dichotomy can be seen. If you throw out all of us who don't show an OKC address and presumably can't vote, it is 6-2 (75%) in favor of YES. I don't get it. Why would someone that doesn't even live in OKC, especially someone from say Tulsa, NOT be in favor of the tax?

Part of this is copied and pasted from another place because I don't want to retype it: "A vote for the Arena tax is a vote to put tax dollars in the Gaylords' pockets." I'm almost embarrassed to say I live here. First of all, there are 8 owners, and not a one is named Gaylord, One of the 8 is married to a Gaylord. Most of these owners have been amazing philanthropists for this city. They've been working to improve the city for years, and now we're treating them like they're from Mars. These are citizens of our city. Seattle's problem with this group is that they're not from Seattle. That's right, this entire group is from Oklahoma City. That's most cities ownership dream: to have local ownership. And last of all, and I'm going to capitalize it because I'm sick of people not knowing this: THERE IS NO DATA TO PROVE THIS OWNERSHIP GROUP WILL EVEN MAKE A PENNY HERE. MR. MCCLENDON SAID THEY'D BE HAPPY IF THEY BREAK EVEN. THAT'S BECAUSE 30% OF ALL NBA TEAMS OPERATE IN THE RED. They LOSE money. This is not a money making scheme. This is these men's attempt to give us what we had when the Hornets were here. They were at the games. They saw how the city loved the team, and they want to recreate that experience FOR US. Why do people here act like they're out to get us? They've spent almost half a billion dollars of their own money to bring this team here, and we're spitting in their faces and treating them no better than they're being treated up in Seattle. We should be ashamed of ourselves.

http://www.nbacriminals.com/

Bill, since when is anyone in Tulsa a "we"? I'll counter that with Chris Paul, 4.0 student at Wake Forest, Tim Duncan, same school, David Robinson, Naval Academy. The NBA has a fabulous public service mandate for their players. Imagine Kevin Durant reading to your child at school. There are some players who can provide a very positive role model for our children. The problems Bill is talking about are far more common in our community already than they are in the NBA. Let's let the NBA give back to our community, as they do in all the communities in which they are located.

Although I hav many reasons for voting YES, the best reason for anyone is that we're going to end up fixing up the Ford Center is a few years even if we vote no today. We've already fallen behind Tulsa, Wichita, Omaha and Kansas City's arenas, and we're soon going to be losing the concerts and entertainment we finally started getting instead of Tulsa when we built the Ford Center. We built it on the cheap because we were almost out of MAPS money. Let's do it right now, because we're going have to do it anyway. Let's keep saying YES to progress in OKC and get an NBA basketball team for our city in the process

The answer is NO, we don't want the NBA, with its image problems, fatherless children, egomaniacs, and shootings. No, thanks.

If you voted “Yes” for any of the previous MAPs projects, you would be a hypocrite for not voting “Yes” today. We have invested so much in Bricktown that it would be foolish to abandon it all now. That money will have all been wasted. I have voted “No” and every MAPs tax vote that has come my way. However I am voting “Yes” today because I can realize that we need to finish the job we started. This is it. This is the reason we did all the other projects. This will be Brisktown’s #1 attraction. Don’t mess this up because of some flawed reasoning.

As usualy Berry has nailed the issues correctly. It's the perfect storm for OKC. The voters have a great rack record there and they usually get it right. In this case getting it right means voting YES!!!

All you "vote NO" people are right- let's just board up the Skirvin, bulldoze Bricktown and go back to 1989. Let the brain drain continue so you tightwads don't have to pay an extra *penny* for 15 stinking months.

Vote yes and keep the momentum of this great city of ours moving forward.

Keep moving forward, vote yes . We will just have to keep dragging these knucklehead no voters along with us into the future. This is an easy decision, vote yes.

Remember when we were voting on building the Ford Center? "If we want NHL, we need this". What happened to the NHL? The same thing that could happen with the NBA.

I love how all the sports writers and people on radio are for this since they will never have to pay for a ticket and most live outside the OKC metro so they won't be paying the tax either.

vote NO.....

Vote NO....

Don't let this pass us by, Vote yes to continue the progress and reality of the dream that started 14 years ago.

The funny part about this crap the city is offering is the fact that, YOU THE TAX PAYER will pay for the upgrades to the ford center and to build a practice facility for bennett and the nba, then the city said it will turn around and lease these buildings to them therefore making them more money from it! In other words THE CITY, BENNETT AND THE NBA WILL MAKE LOADS OF MONEY FROM YOU THE TAX PAYER and then you still have to give them EVEN MORE MONEY to get into the door to watch the game! You would be VERY DUMB to vote for this! VOTE NO!!!!

Lets push this thru OKC....Vote yes

Im voting yes.....Oklahoma City needs to step out of the dark ages.

I'm unclear how bringing the NBA, with its horrible image, to OKC improves the city's quality of life. This has not been thought out very well. I understand that the millionaires want taxpayers to pay for their toys, and that their politician friends want to help them, but OKC has bigger problems that need to be solved first. We need leadership, not more taxes.