Roger, please feel free to correct the "same 3 or 4 stupid things" at anytime. You make fun of them and complain about them but you rarely answer questions posed with honest, no-spin answers (do you work for the Mayor or the Chamber?)

Same posts over and over and over again....If your main goal in life is to bitch and moan on an internet forum please at least come up with some original material now and then....500 posts pointing out the same 3 or 4 stupid things loses a little of it's effectiveness over time

Leonard..OKC doesn't care about biking trails, walkways, etc, because we're one of America's fattest cities, also #1 in heart attack and #2 in strokes. Those types of quality of life enhancements you speak of i other cities aren't wanted here, because to utilize them means effort, which means a few calories burnt..you get my picture. It's far more desirable to go to a game of baseball and buy an all you can eat seat, or just to go to a B-ball game and sit on your fat duff in a tooo small seat and gorge yourself..thats "gettin' er done" here in Okie...

You are all really wasting your time trying to justify/rationalize the economics of having a sports franchise and all the public money, tax breaks etc that it takes to lure one. The fact is, you really can't, the numbers almost never add up. Any benefit is largely intanglible in the form of community image, spin-off tourism etc. However for the most part having a pro franchise is an extravigant form of quality of life issue. Some Okies have been criticizing Seattle for a plan to upgrade biking trails there. Things like parks, hiking and biking trails etc are highly valued quality of life factors in a west coast city like Seattle, Vancouver BC, Portland or any California coastal city. I don't really expect flat-landers in OKC or a place like Houston to be able to truly understand that, but few in Seattle probably find that type of issue trivial actually. To them, it is a quality of life issue, just like a sports franchise, and they have endulged in their share of those too. However in the case of the Sonics/Key Arena issue, the timing and public mood just betrayed them.

So the report on this website states they'll employ 170 people, when in fact they employ 68, and that includes the players. They get an estimated tax break of 60 million dollars over 15 years to bring what will probably work out to be 40 (or less, after removing the players roster) transferred jobs to OKC?? PLUS, OKC practically paid the team to take the naming rights "off" OKC's hands, rather then the team pay the city? can this local or state government be any more inept?

You guys are right on some accounts. Janitors, fry cooks and ticket takers work for the Arena and not the Sonics. The SOnics employ 68 people in Seattle including players. All the high level jobs will most likely move with the team, otherwise they would have to train people for those jobs. Alot of the "jobs" created will be college internships (which they already get tax breaks from). They will create jobs for phone slaes reps and other lower level jobs, but not many. Oh, and one more thing having players pay state income tax on their income is another reason Players won't want to live in OKC or get traded there. Not sure how your income tax works, some states you pay where your primary residence is. I work all over the country I don't have to pay state income in the other states I work in. If OK allows for the collect of income tax for players visiting OK, and if other states do that too. The players on OKC team could be paying state income twice for road games, once as part of their state income tax for OK and once for the states where they had road games. Seems like a mess to me.

Call me pathetic if you will Chris, but since I'm accurate in my assessments it's really not ME who is the pathetic one....

Good ness gracious, whose arse do u have to kiss to get that, bend over i need a deal like that!

Pathetic Paul speaks again...and again...and again...

And just think, this newspaper just so happened to release an article today that Oklahomans are (or soon will be) feeling an increase in most everything, INCLUDING entertainment.....bye bye 20 dollar tickets...hello 6 dollar hot dogs.....

Michael..perhaps, with your infinite wisdom of Dell, can tell us what the average wage there is , since you know it's above the local and state average you must have access to the numbers..please share...

if you want to know call dell ask them, I happen to think it is a great place to work and could not have better people working there. You just have to like any business reign in cost, restructure, and make it a profit driven company. Just like any business. I think companies willing to spend millions to create jobs that pay more then the average salary in the state and city is a wonderful thing, look at the other development that is going on. Devon is building a new icon of a building, sonics are going to be coming to OKC and creating new jobs from management, sales and yes to a smaller aspect service related jobs. I think we are trying to focus on the wrong issue here. Do you want to support the creation of jobs or not. States and mostly cities have to make exceptions to land companies to relocate to there city. It comes down to progress do you want stagnation of the job market or growth that brings more tax revenue in all avenues of the economy.

People here have got it right. Any jobs the Sonics bring will be low-level, minimum wage jobs. All the money goes to the millionaire owners and players. Quality jobs, my eye

Sounds like the "Quality Jobs" are already taken by the out of state players and owners...the ones making million(s)...unless they are going to start over and hire Oklahomans to fill the high dollar player positions, hard to see how the the Sonics (or whatever they are going to be called) qualify. Don't know the details of the Quality Jobs program and how it all works, but am sure someone will enlighten me. But read somewhere along the way that the State (not the City) will be getting income tax not only from the players on the OKC team but every player in the league (that plays a game here) also has to pay Oklahoma income tax (probably not on their entire salary, but only for the pro-rated portion they "earned" while in the state)...no wonder professional athletes get paid so much if they have to pay full salary income taxes in their state of residence and pro-rated taxes in every state they play in...and having to pay for the professional personal accountant to keep all of that straight! WOW

Especially when it's gonna take 2 or more than likely 5 to upkeep the practice center and they've only allocated 20 thousand a year for that (including janitorial supplies)...doesn't sound like quality jobs to me...maybe they'll hire illegals and get a dozen....

I'm just curious about how fry cooks, ticket takers, and janitors qualify as 'quality jobs?'

But I'll bet even though they eliminated jobs Michael..they still got to keep all the tax breaks as if they had a full work force, right??

I see somebody deep in the bowels of city government looking at this Paul from Yukon dude...and they're thinking,,he's an outsider..and he's not easily boondoggled...and he can do math....we need more spin..we need more spin.....better make up a new and improved story line soon....make the locals think we're genuine.......and looking out for somebodys interests other than Bennett/Gaylord/our own hides......we need spin....where's Jill???

jan, you info is wrong they just shifted the focus to business, corporate accounts and it support.

Depending on how you look at it, either SNAFU or TARFUN!!! Does Gaylord/Bennett own the Legislature, too? Oh yeah, at election time, they do have to run ads.

Why would Dell eliminate jobs HERE, and create them in Texas?

"Two citizens spoke against the bill."...Bet no one can guess who the other person was..Wanda, David...Please return to whatever the heck you were doing before the Ford center vote...Tired of reading your whining in every Sonics related article

Wanda Jo doesn't seem to carry alot of influence. Robert from Seattle, I hope you're still laughing when the Sonics move here. We will be....

Now..lets do some more math..lets say that the Sonics are taxed at a rate of 8 3/4%, and that 8 3/4 % equals 100 million dollars a year..(somebody get me a bigger calculator please)..are we to believe that the monies generated by the Sonics is in the billions every year?? Please....

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the numbers listed are accurate(which I highly doubt), then the Sonics will get back about 4.5 million per year? Therefore, with that amount being 5.5%, the state is going to see tax revenue solely from the Sonics of approximately 94 million per year? I find that truly hard to believe...no city in their right mind would allow a team to leave no matter how ludicrous their demands were...

I don't think they closed the center..they just announced a lot of cutbacks, and then created a bunch of jobs in Texas....imagine that....

Hey Jan..who besides the team owners got your "win-win" on practically giving away 4 million dollars a year or more on naming rights??

Jan...didn't Dell Computer get a similar deal from the City/State? And didn't Dell announce, not very long ago, they were closing the Call Center in Oklahoma City?

NBA teams never make any money or pay any state or federal income tax.

TBA teams NEVER make any money and thus do not have any income to pay state or federal income taxes on. This tax break will never be used.

Robert of SEATTLE, first of all I love your city, its salmon, its many, fine and varied restaurants. The Pike Street Market, Etc. But, to get to the subject, the lease also has provisions for profit-sharing payments to the City. The tax rebates, if they get them, are dependent on specific levels of new job creation by the Sonics. It is a standard incentive for
demonstratable job-creation our state has for new industry. If they create the jobs and get the tax rebate, it costs taxpayers nothing because the amount of the rebate is less than the income and sales tax flow from the jobs created. While our taxpayers may very well be nice, some of them are also smart. They believe in incentives to new businesses which more than pay for themselves. It's called win-win!

Jill...where are you? You are the only one that can make any sense out of this for me!

Ok I get it first you give the team a 20 year lease at 1.6 million (the average is 7 million per year). Now they get tax rebates of 60 million over 15 years. No wonder tehy love you people. Your giving them about 10 million plus a year, I move there if i get 10 million a year for 15 years. Well we know who is paying for this, you got to be the nicest taxpayers in the world. Please note we are laughing with you not at you all.

BOHICA,Baby!!!!!

Uh-oh...here it comes!

Well, Michael, by Dell cutting what, 300 plus jobs here in OKC, explain how they brought growth to this city. For that matter, they didn't even contribute to stagnation, they headed in a downward direction..