What fans are saying

Published: July 2, 2008

Here are what Sonics fans were saying earlier today when news of a settlement negotiation first broke on NewsOK.com.

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Jim from Del City, Yankees are from the northeast. Northwesterners are called...um...geoducks? Yeah, geoducks. Totally.
Maria - Jul 8, 2008 1:17 AM
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Congratulations OKC.. I think it's awesome!! Welcome back to the NBA. Looking forward to seeing OKC play here in Houston next year.
Brian, Houston - Jul 8, 2008 1:11 AM
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Hey people from Seattle, we have been hated by better people then you for a heck of a lot longer then this. At least Texans have some class!
Don, Norman - Jul 6, 2008 10:34 AM
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Anybody else about tired of these loud mouthed yankee bastards. Seriously talk about a bunch of sore losers. Ever try reading what they have to say about us on their websites? It's amazing the level of ignorance and hatred they can achieve.
jim, del city - Jul 6, 2008 1:18 AM
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Speaking as a big time Sonics fan (and fan of most every other team in this area) plus a former Sonic season ticket holder of multiple seasons ...... there is absolutely no reason why the City of Seattle should be begging the NBA to return. The NBA should be begging Seattle for forgiveness, not vice versa.

Let me put this in business perspective: If I treated my customer base the way the Sonics & the NBA have treated their customer base, how many of my customers do you think would be apologizing to me? We fans are the customers, the NBA is the business. This business to expects it’s customers to pay more because the business just screwed over the fans? Is this how business works? Really?

It is time for cities across this nation to stop the nonsense. The reason NBA owners extort cities is because the cities have been dumb enough to let them do it. Speaking as a conservative here ..... Conservatives demand no government intervention in their businesses, or as little governmental intervention as possible. But that goes both ways. If a business is to be run without governmental intervention, you cannot really demand the government then comes back and rescues the business when the business goes bad. That makes absolutely no sense and is contrary to the Conservative way of doing things and capitalism in general.

Businesses need to pay for their own overhead. If a business cannot flourish while doing that, then it is up to the business, not the customers, to fix their own business plan. Nor is it the responsibility of the government to step in and pour more funds into the venture. That type of thinking is exactly what drives conservatives up the wall about liberals. Conservatives demand that budgets be hit by finding new ways to get competitive, including cutting parts of a business that are the least profitable. Liberals just want to add taxes while the parts of the venture that are not profitable are still funded. So right there on the surface, I don't know how any conservative could ever support subsidizing a fledging business unless that business proves absolutely that their presence in the community leads directly to increased tax revenues. And yet with $500 million spent on new stadiums every 20 years or less ...... seems like long odds that professional sports lives up to the claim. Especially with the Sonics who just got a sparkling new stadium a decade ago.

The NBA is a business. The fan base are the customers. Let's not forget that. Customers who have been scammed by a business do not go rushing out to build a new building for a business that just screwed them over. If I defaulted on my home loan, or opted out on my lease, next time getting a home loan or lease will be considerably more difficult. And deservedly so. Banks are not foolish enough to lend new funds to businesses who just defaulted. Why should the fans and taxpayers of this city do that? If the NBA had lived up to the terms of their lease and the city had gotten what they expected when the lease was signed, then that's one thing. But in this case we have a league who apparently feels it's just fine to break leases once that money has been spent, for their product. And the league itself admits that the business plan is not working. Can they prove to the cities that tax revenues are greater than expenses? Thus far the NBA hasn’t done that, and certainly not when they refuse to live up to the leases they sign with landlords.

So sorry Seattle Sonic fans, but speaking in totally business terms here, businesses that break leases and default on loans do not deserve more expensive loans and leases the next time. So the NBA has a credit worthiness problem here, and it gets down to the "fool me once" issue. The NBA just demonstrated their league and owners are not trustworthy. And Seattle is certainly not the first city to be stung by these guys. So don't ask us for a new building next time NBA. Because we can't trust you. You just proved that. You want a new team in Seattle, fine, you build the building this time and you'd better spend a ton of effort wooing back the very customer base you just wronged. Because that's how businesses do things and you my friends, are just another business, albeit one with very bad credit at this point.

And you can argue that Bennett DID make the numbers right in Seattle with the settlement, but that was only after being sued into submission. And it does not take into account the emotional damage done to the customer base, which is every bit as important to fans as the numbers. So Bennett fails on multiple front here, and it simply amazes some of us that other cities are willing to do this deal given the track record of owners in professional sports leagues. Especially, now, Mr Clay Bennett.
Phil, Edmonds - Jul 5, 2008 11:55 AM
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I can't imagine the NFL, MLB & NHL are too happy with this situation either. Because of the credit issue, one team in one league hurts all teams in all leagues. As soon as fans get fed up with tax subsidies for new stadiums then they all go down with the ship, even if it's not their ship.

Clay Bennett is a villan in more sports than just basketball, and no doubt David Stern is hearing an earful from other commissioners whose products Stern & Bennett just hurt. If there was a lawsuit to be had, it would be the other three major sports leagues suing the NBA for being business morons that have hurt their leagues.


Phil, Edmonds - Jul 5, 2008 11:50 AM
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Jim, part of the "promise" is the legally binding contract that ran thru the 2010 season. He also promised to try to get an arena deal done in order to keep the Sonics in Seattle for a full year (he didn't do that), then after the year was up he could start the relocation process (but still not actually moving the team until the end of the lease).
Larry, Oklahoma City - Jul 5, 2008 3:00 AM
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So Bored with Seattle Fans whining...
corina, moore - Jul 4, 2008 9:24 PM
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T from seatown, Cuban only voted against it because it would cut into his market. He gets the 3.5 million fans in Oklahoma by default without pro sports here. Oklahoma has always supported Dallas' pro sports. With a team here there will be less Mavs fans crossing the red river. Not that it will hurt the Mavs. Cuban was just looking out for his own.
jim, del city - Jul 4, 2008 9:00 PM
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Steve the 'promise' made when purchasing the team was that he would not move the team for a period of one year in an effort to try to work something out with the washington legislature, not that he would not move the team until the lease was up.
jim, del city - Jul 4, 2008 8:51 PM
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Another thought you say we of Seattle did not support our team. How well would you take it if the Sooners had a couple of years of losing, not very well. There would be a lot of upset people and cries for the coaches firing. Well we in Seattle had to watch losing for 5 straight years.
steve, seattle - Jul 4, 2008 8:09 PM
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There was also a local tribe that offered to build an arena and CLay would not even talk to them. I don't think the fans of OKC are aware that his purchase of the team included promise that he would not move the team until the lease was up.
steve, seattle - Jul 4, 2008 8:02 PM
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Tony, once again your use of the facts are horrible. And once again I'd like to point out that I am not pointing any fingers at OKC or even Clay Bennett. OKC deserves a team and there was probably no other way to get a team to the region than by moving an existing one. My only argument is that once Clay Bennett got the team, there was no reasonable way Seattle could have kept them. Do I think that is wrong? A little. Do I blame Clay? Absolutely not. If anyone, I blame the NBA for allowing a team to move when the team had ample support and local buyers willing to pay to keep them.

First of, as Larry from OKC pointed out, I-91 was not an absolute ban and pretty much irrelevant.

Also, Clay's proposal called for the most expensive arena in the nation. Comparing it to the Maloof's $600 million proposal that got shot down is again irrelevant. I never said Clay's proposal was for the most expensive arena ever proposed. Just if it would have passed, it would have been the most expensive NBA arena. Doesn't seem that hard to understand.

Additionally, Clay's proposal to the legislature was for an arena in which the Sonics contributed nothing and would not pay for any cost overruns. Your statement that "BENNETT WAS NEVER GIVEN A CHANCE TO COMMIT HOW MUCH HE WOULD PUT UP before the Washington legislature told him his proposal was "dead in the water"" is completely false (though I do like the use of the Caps Lock button). You do not seem to understand how legislature works. The legislature will never pass a proposal and then decide how it should be funded. The proposal included a funding plan. It was "dead in the water" because none of that funding was from the Sonics. The legislature cannot pass a proposal and then go "Ok, now how much would you like to put in Clay?"

As for the Key Arena renovation, it was a $95.5 million total renovation of which the City paid $74.5 million. I did think the city contributed more.

Also I must differ on your analysis of the "fair terms" that you think Clay would have accepted. Clay wanted to move the team to OKC and the only way he would leave the team in Seattle is if the city could guarantee him a consistent stream of profit. You even describe it as a classic "win/win" situation for Clay. Only problem is that the taxpayers lose because they have to subsidize Clay's business if he stays. I don't know any business that works like this and I do not think it was possible to come to a fair agreement under these circumstances. While I definitely think NBA owners have a right to make money and lots of it, I don't think it is "fair" for the taxpayers to have to guarantee a billionaire's profit to prevent a move.

Honestly, I share the same feeling of you being "sick and tired of Seattleites pointing fingers at everything", but I am also sick of OKC fans insisting on blaming Seattlites for not going along with sponsoring Clay's "win/win situation."
Rick, Seattle - Jul 4, 2008 4:52 PM
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Tony, Norman, not sure if it is out of ignorance or what but you are spinning and twisting so much I 'm not sure where to begin...but I will start with I-91, you wrote: "...restriction against using public funds for a pro sports facility". From what I have read on it, it only requires that the taxpayers are guaranteed a modest return on their investment. May not exist anywhere else but it certainly should.
Larry, Oklahoma City - Jul 4, 2008 3:57 PM
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Jeff: IMO, I don't think our City leaders took any money (but could be wrong) to "trick okc ppl into voting to redo ford center so these few thiefs could make millions", they seem to have done it all on their own (Mayor Mick even said no one at the NBA told him to do it, it was all his idea). They really don't seem to be all that smart (again IMO) Never having a plan b if the vote failed...being "sophisticated" after negotiating a lease with the Hornets (where OKC got over $1 million in net profit after the Hornets) to a lease that was approached with a "break-even philosophy", a lease that last 15 to 30 years)..to the giving away of the naming rights (if handled correctly, worth at least the $90 million Memphis got for theirs)...to the Mayor's admission that we have too few seats in the Ford (and the fact that AFTER the improvements are made there will be 500 fewer seats, dropping us from #14 to #24 in NBA arenas)...the fact that OKC is on the hook to keep making "NBA standards upgrades to the Ford for the next 15 to 30 years (with no way to even come close to paying for it)...the list goes on and on....
Larry, Oklahoma City - Jul 4, 2008 3:47 PM
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Rick, I repeat: IGNORANCE. That word literally means IGNORE-ance. You IGNORE City of Seattle Initiative 91, the local constitutional (City Charter) restriction against using public funds for a pro sports facility. I'm sure you'll talk about all the ways around it, but the FACT is that a legal obstacle exists to getting public funding for an arena in Seattle that doesn't exist anywhere else in the United States. To the extent that the Maloof Brother's proposal was turned down by the voters of Sacramento (but is still alive, via a Mariners-type sleight of hand by the legislature), that doesn't detract from the FACT that your statement that Bennett asked for "the most expensive basketball arena in the nation" was flat WRONG.

And you talk about the $50 million that the Orlando owners agreed to put up but in your arrogance or ignorance, you fail to point out that BENNETT WAS NEVER GIVEN A CHANCE TO COMMIT HOW MUCH HE WOULD PUT UP before the Washington legislature told him his proposal was "dead in the water". Again, shouldn't you point out the overriding failure of your elected officials to make a counteroffer? We'll never know what Bennett would have done, because he was never given the chance!

And you again overlook the fact that there is something to be said for the FACT that the Mariners were about to leave Seattle. The Seahawks were about to leave Seattle. The Sonics threatened to leave Seattle for at least four years before they actually did. There is a common denominator here: the Washington legislature and the people of Seattle (i.e. "the man in the mirror").

I mean GRIFFIN. You know, the guy who was the mouthpiece for the "Poisoned Well" group of backstabbers who tried to steal the team from Bennett. I am not confusing him with anyone. You call the group of Slade Gorton and Wally Walker's covert operatives the Ballmer Group. And the city only spent $75 million on the 1993 renovation of the circa 1962 Seattle Center Coliseum, not $100 million. And that renovation did nothing to address the major problem with that facility; the fact that it is TOO SMALL to be a functional NBA arena in this day and age. When I said "Griffin", I meant GRIFFIN. But how SCHULTZ could ask for a renovation "seven" years (actually nine, but who's counting?) after the on-the-cheap renovation to the circa 1962 Seattle Center Coliseum was done was because the arena was (is) a MONEY PIT given current NBA economics.

Do I really think Clay Bennett would have stayed in Seattle under "fair terms"? ABSOLUTELY. Why wouldn't they? Bennett and his partners were in a classic win/win situation when they bought the teams. They could either get an arena deal done and make a ton of money operating the teams in Seattle (or by selling the teams in a "sweet flip") AND expand their other businesses to a new market to boot; or move their franchise to their hometown and make a ton of money.

I appreciate your comments about your love of Oklahoma. I mean no disrespect to you. I am just VERY sick and tired of Seattleites pointing fingers at everything except where they need to be pointed - at themselves and their elected leaders.
Tony, Norman - Jul 4, 2008 3:12 PM
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Chun, Thank you for your post. I'm sure your gracious attitude is the best representation of the majority of your citizens. Seattle looks like a wonderful city and I hope to visit there some day. Oklahoma will take good care of the team. We are very good at making people feel at home and welcome. The spirit that drives this city is very strong. We are VERY excited to have them come here, we loved having the Hornets when they needed a place to play. I'm sorry you are losing the team, but you are most welcome to come and visit us here, you'll see why the team is in good hands and will have and incredible amount of support from the citizens of Oklahoma.
c, yukon - Jul 4, 2008 3:01 PM
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Clay Bennett was transparent from day one; everyone knew from day one that he and his pack of lying hyenas had no intention of keeping basketball in Seattle. From his first press conference - to his last he has been dishonest. It's a shame that the entire state of Oklahoma is now being linked with these kinds of morals. Southern hospitality, integrity and graciousness must be reserved to those south of Oklahoma, because even up here in the far reaches of the Northwest a man's word means a lot. Obviously not the case in Oklahoma. Even the Dallas Mavericks owner, from the great state of Texas was the only owner not swayed by Clay's buddy David Stern, and voted to have the Sonics stay in their rightful place. By the way - Why did David Stern not have to testify?

Our politicians were skeptical of Clay's efforts from the beginning, and made working with him almost impossible. He demanded a half billion dollar building be built for him, the most expensive basketball arena in the USA, but was unwilling to contribute to the cause. Very noble of him; would have gone a long way to show his sincere commitment to the region if he had.

Seattle is very progressive, but things don't get done overnight. It took some time but we did build a brand new baseball stadium, one of the finest, at a very high price tag - but it was a joint public & private partnership. Seattle constructed a tremendous football stadium, state of the art, but yet it too was a private / public subsidized venture. When the Sonics wanted to completely remodel / rebuild Key Arena 12 years ago it got done and was also a private - public partnership. These buildings were all built with public and private monies - where as Clay Bennett would not offer any contribution to the cause to get the ball rolling.

Seattle will get a new basketball arena with Ballmer's future ownership group coming forward and offering to pay half the cost of the building, Bennett never offered to pay a dime because he never wanted to keep the team in Seattle as the emails so aptly point out. The Oklahoma hero whose lies and deceiving acts must make you all very proud.

Lets put it this way, in straight talk - which might be foreign to Oklahoman's alike, Seattle is still paying off the new Qwest Stadium, Safeco Field, and the newly remodeled Key Arena (144 months old); it would be like a home owner having not one, but three mortgages at the same time, and then be asked to tear down one of those homes and rebuild it again, at an even far greater cost; and then given a small window of time to accomplish this feat. We have a proven record of getting projects like this done – but his timetable was unrealistic – and his motives transparent and insincere. Hard to work with someone when you don’t believe a word out of his mouth. The city of Seattle was not going to be held at ransom by a group of ‘shysters’, which is exactly what they were. Yes Oklahoma you can be very proud to call Clay Bennett one of your own.

David Stern spoke highly of Key Arena upon his first visit in 1995, but then deemed it unsuitable for his product less than 10 years later. 10 years is all an arena gets these days. How long will the Ford Center be good in the eyes of Stern & Bennett.

Now Key Arena is not the Taj Majal but it is no dump; but unless you are a wealthy luxury box owner it is a fabulous place to watch basketball, intimate with great sight lines. It is a terrific basketball arena - but it is NOT a large shopping mall with 100 high priced luxury suites, & 75 restaurants, that is demanded these days. It’s a basketball arena - home of the Seattle Sonics for a better part of 41 years.

Now a days we have congressional inquiries and trials into whether a player uses steroids or not; and then there are ongoing trials into the ensuing perjury that occurred from those events. Should Clay Bennett not be held to the same standards? The senate inquired on behalf of the people, against players cheating; should they not do the same when a owner steals a 41 year old franchise from a community and then perjures himself repeatedly on the stand. Yes this is a man Oklahoma can be proud of.

The community of Seattle has 'always' supported this team. Clay Bennett’s idea of a “Good Faith Effort” was to strip it of all its marquee players, and trade away any player that could make them competitive - Seattle fans still showed up in the stands. Would Oklahoma show up at Oklahoma football games and support a man who was trying to take that football program to - say Montana? Well -Seattle did. Even when Clay Bennett managed to put the worst product Seattle has ever seen in its ‘41-year history’ - they did not play in front of 7,000 fans. Though he tried in vain, he never could completely disengage the Seattle Sonic fan base; while getting rid of all fan favorites, even coaches with long ties to Seattle basketball and the community - just the opposite thing you would do if you were trying to build fan support for a new arena.

Seattle will get another franchise - but we won't rip one out of somebody else's community. We have had polls in Seattle - and overwhelmingly people voted up here that we would not want to be granted a team if it meant stealing one, and all its history from another city. I guess you can say that is where people from Oklahoma and Seattle differ - its called morals; look it up in the dictionary if you don't understand what it truly means.

Though you successfully stole our team - you cannot buy a team's history - it is Not something you purchase - it is something you live; something that is woven into the community, into the people that shared the fond memories - not something you buy. Make your own history and then rightfully celebrate it. Don't make mock NBA Championship trophies and banners that have absolutely no meaning to you. Remember a NBA team does not make you a big city, any more than Los Angeles losing the Rams made them a small city. Oklahoma will still be Oklahoma – with just another entertainment value available.

I was in Oklahoma for the first time a week ago, and met many nice people when I was there; and came away with the feeling they were happy to get a team but they did not agree with how they were getting one. From what I saw of the area - I have no idea how Oklahoma plans on supporting an NBA team - past the 3-5 year novelty phase, at which point your hero will be asking for a new arena to be able to compete - even though Ford Center looked adequate.

Most of you from Oklahoma know an injustice was done - and for you to stand for this injustice and not voice your opinion - makes you no better then Clay Bennett. I have read that Clay is regarded as a hero now, while most of the United States reserve that term for the likes of our ‘honorable’ fighting troops, policemen and the like. For any of you to consider him a hero for what he has done - only shows your lack of integrity & values - for he has painted your state, your region with a brush of dishonesty, and unscrupulous behavior that will far outlive your short NBA lives.

Tom


T, Seatown - Jul 4, 2008 2:50 PM
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Is this Jeff guy for real? I've never seen so many typos is such a short note. No wonder Seattle lost its team with fans like that. It would be hard to keep a job with spelling and grammar like that and we all know it takes money to buy tickets to any pro team's games. Get over it Jeff and all you other Seattle fans. Blame your city leaders and Mr. Starbucks because that's where the blame lies. Why attack everyone in Oklahoma because your state screwed up? Also, how many games did you attend last season? I bet truth be known is that you and many of the other Seattle fans posting on this site failed to support the team for the past five years or so. That's why Mr. Starbucks wanted to sell the team in the first place, because you guys weren't supporting the Sonics. So, get over it.
Maury, Lawton - Jul 4, 2008 12:21 PM
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Dear Fans of the Seattle SuperSonics to whom have written opinions on this site:
I am writing this letter to response of the many opinions written about Oklahoma. Oklahoman are a proud group of people. Its made up of many different races and cultures. The people here are educated, have jobs and are proud of their heritage.
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I doubt any payoff was made to the city leaders to trick the people of Oklahoma City. If you want to question tactics of a city...question the tactics of Seattle city leaders to bleed the team owners dry. Prime example of a city wanting to keep their team. The opinion in this state is that Seattle didn't want their team till it was leaving. And your state government not wanting to fund a new stadium. That speaks volumes.
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You brought up the subject of the Native Americans. I Google d the many different tribes in the state of Washington...Guess what? Same thing happened up there. Tribes ceding their land to the US Government.
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My understanding of the transaction of the sales of the Sonics to Mr. Bennett was a legal sale. He bought the team and now its HIS right as owner to do anything he can to make them profitable. OKC appears to be a hot market for NBA basketball. OKC is hot and Seattle is not.That happens all the time with businesses.

My suggestion is to display your right to vote. Vote the people out whom did not want to support your team. Your city government, state government. Boycott Starbucks. He is the one who sold the team. He is all about expansion that he overdid it and now is closing 600 stores across the nation. Blame the economy or blame greed. Hundreds are losing jobs to the closings.
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With all that being said...one last thought. Call Microsoft and asked for help using Spellchecker. They will be glad to help you.
Allen, Kingfisher - Jul 4, 2008 11:17 AM
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Jeff you are some kind of inbred idiot.
Duane, Oklahoma City, Ok. - Jul 4, 2008 9:56 AM
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wow, so yall got your team, what a classes state, yall couldnt get your own team so ya stole someone elses,,,,,,,but why am i shocked at this , after all yall been stealing property since day one of being okolahoma, just ask any indian, wounder how much money went to under the table pay offs to city leaders to trick okc ppl into voting to redo ford center so these few thiefs could make millions
jeff - Jul 4, 2008 8:49 AM
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Tony, My ignorance? Are you kidding me? You shouldn't be trying to call out someone's facts when yours are completely off. First, Sacramento has not agreed on a new arena at all. In fact the Maloofs proposed a $600 million arena (Clay's Renton plan was $500 million), but the voters overwhelmingly rejected it. Currently they are in talks on a mixed use facility at Cal Expo. Second, Orlando's arena is $480 million and the Magic agreed to pay $50 million upfront and agreed to cover any cost overrun. That is obviously less than Clay's Renton plan and Clay did not agree to pay any costs at all.

As for Seattle's 41 year history of professional sports, I really don't think you can criticize it. We have never lost a team before except for the Pilots who were here for one season (1969-70) almost 40 years ago. And are you seriously going to bring up the Pilots? They were here for one season 40 years ago and Bud Selig did the same thing as Clay Bennett (bought them and moved them to his hometown despite strong opposition). Additionally, we supported the Sonics since they were an expansion team. Interesting the only West Coast NBA team that was still in its original location. Another interesting fact most don't know outside of Seattle, the Sonics definitely had the most loyal fanbase here and out of all the Seattle teams are the one team who have never been close to moving and have consistently drawn fans. As stated before, I honestly think OKC will be a good home for pro sports, but really how can you call out Seattle's history as a pro sports city with 3 teams for the last 35 years when OKC has never had a pro sports team before? Also, "Griffin" (I assume you mean Howard Schultz) was asking for a new arena when he wasn't even half way through his previous lease. How do you ask for a new arena 7 years after the city has spent $100 million renovating an arena to the specification of the then owner Barry Ackerley.

Also, what "local constitutional restriction" are you talking about? I really may be mistaken, but I believe you are referring to the vote to not let the Sonics out of their lease.

Regardless of all that, do you really think Clay Bennett would have let the team stay in Seattle under fair terms? His only offer was you build me a $500 million arena and I pay nothing. You have seen the emails right?
Rick, Seattle - Jul 4, 2008 3:12 AM
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Dear OKC, as a Seattle Sonic fan for a long time I am angry that the Sonics are leaving Seattle. I blame Clay Bennett, but it was HIS team since he owned it. Of course I would have something against him since he moved the team. But our city officials completely screwed up. First, they did not grant Schultz a new arena when he requested one. Then Schultz sold the team to Bennett. Seattle officials let me down. I am just depressed right now because the team I looked up to is gone and I won't be able to watch Durant and Green and Westbrook grow up and be good NBA players. But I wish OKC the best of luck and to PLEASE take good care of the "Sonics". Hope you people are excited.
Chun, Seattle - Jul 4, 2008 2:00 AM
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Rick, your arrogance is surpassed only by your ignorance. In the last two months, Orlando and Sacramento have committed to building arenas for more than the cost that Clay Bennett and the PBC requested for the Renton arena. And let's not forget that 75% of the voters of Seattle passed a local constitutional restriction against providing public money for an arena. And it's not like the Olympians came back with a lower counteroffer to Bennett's proposal; they just said the proposal was "dead in the water". Didn't even vote it out of committee. Not that a lower offer would have had a chance. They told your local hero, Griffin to go to hell when he only asked for $75 million.

And the fact is that Seattle only sold 17 of its 35 luxury suites. That's where the big money comes from to support NBA teams.

The 14 year old (20 years old by the time a new arena could be built) remodel of Key Arena was done on the small and cheap, and now it is old and outdated. If it was 100% full, it would still be a financial disaster given the terms of that lease.

For a good part of the "41 year tradition" of pro sports in Seattle, the franchises have been trying to get out of there (Pilots, Sonics, Seahawks, Mariners). Doesn't that strike you the least bit strange? Could it be that the problem is not Clay Bennett, but rather the man in the mirror?


Tony, Norman - Jul 4, 2008 12:50 AM
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Hi OKC, Congratulations on getting an NBA team. I am not here to bad mouth you guys or your city. My Dad lived in Tulsa and I love the area and from the reaction I am seeing it appears you will support them well. I did just want to clear up some misinformation I am reading on here and get some things off my chest.

1. Seattle fans did definitely support the Sonics. The year before Clay got here we had attendance percentage of 95.3% which was 8th in the league. Admittedly we had a smaller capacity than most teams, but we had plenty of sellouts and the fans were buying the seats that were available. Even the first year of Clay's ownership, attendance was still at 94% despite having a rough season. So please, stop saying the fans did not support the Sonics!

2. Seattle does not neglect the Sonics at the expense of the Mariners and Seahawks. Seattle remodeled Key Arena in the 90's and the Sonics still had 4 years left on their lease when Clay got the team. While it is arguable that we should have already had a lease renewal done prior to Clay obtaining the team, I think this is offbase. We still had 4 years left on our current lease in which we could have negotiated and definitely would have negotiated. The longer the Sonics waited it out, the more leverage they would have in any future negotiations. However, once Clay got the team there was no chance of coming to any sort of reasonable agreement. Clay demanded the most expensive basketball arena in the nation and refused to contribute 1 cent. The estimated price of moving the time to OKC is $170 million. If he would have put 60% of that cost ($100 M) towards a new arena in Seattle, the city/state would have surely paid for the rest of the arena and Clay would have saved $70 million and had a brand new arena in the 12th biggest market. Clay's moves were motivated by his heart and I respect that, but it made it impossible for Seattle to negotiate with him.

Additionally, Clay would not even sell the team to Steve Balmer, who would have paid him more than he paid for the team plus interest. And if you really need anymore evidence that Clay wasn't attempting to keep the team in Seattle, you saw the emails. Once Clay got the team, it was over.

Additionally, I strongly believe that this could have happened to any team. Clay loves OKC and was willing to move a team there no matter what the cost. If Clay could have gotten someone to sell him the Celtics or the Lakers, I don't see how anyone could have been able to stop him from moving them to OKC. All he needed was a vote of the board of governors which did not seem to even be an issue. Honestly, once Clay got the team, what more could Seattle have done?

But I must reiterate, I love OKC/Tulsa and definitely think you deserve a team. With the NBA's refusal to grant expansion teams to deserving markets (such as OKC) there really is no option other than buying a team and relocating. I am just sad they decided to target a team that was so important to this area and had a 41 year tradition.
Rick, Seattle - Jul 4, 2008 12:06 AM
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I am with you Jimbo -- Seattle, you still have major league baseball and football not to mention rush hour traffic that can't be beat. I am a fan of Archie McPhee's too! W/ a downtown, (bricktown?) 80,000 indoor football stadium, the NFL will have to send a team (how does the OKC Raiders sound?) to God's country someday!
jerry, Shaktoolik - Jul 3, 2008 11:46 PM
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all of these people are hoping for the NBA team to fail here so they can feel superior. Nobody respected Charlotte when they got their first franchise either. But they seemed to manage just fine. Alot of the same stereotypes were placed on them. We are getting a double dose because a team is also relocating creating a lot of jaded fans who are using stereotypes to take out their frustrations.
jim, del city - Jul 3, 2008 11:27 PM
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all of this hatred over a freaking basketball team. Get a grip Seattle.
jim, del city - Jul 3, 2008 11:22 PM
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Hey, cmon sports fans - let's just get along -- Seattle fans - remember, you'll always have Jim Zorn and Richie Zisk- oh, and Jack Sikma.
OKC NBA Team fans, hey, I like the way that rolls off the tongue, "OKC NBA TEAM" - yeah, forget OKC Sniveling Hypocrites, "OKC NBA TEAM" is the bomb! Will they get Clifford Ray to coach? I hope Alvan Adams is still in good shape - he and Wayman Tisdale could bring the team an NBA title in its first year.
jerry, Shaktoolik - Jul 3, 2008 10:45 PM
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Congrats OKC from a saddened fan of Seattle sports. Seattle is a fan base of fair weather fans. There is a lot to do here and if you put on a good show, we'll come out to see it. Just ask the Seahawks and Mariners, both who won a few games, pushed the panic button over refinance or relocate and won... they tricked us by putting together 2 or 3 wins and that was that, we were hooked, just like fishing... the wins are the shiny irresistible lure. The Sonics, either under Schultz or Bennett never attempted it, there was nothing to go see. No reason to leave the house. Remember we have been through many threats of relocation in the past, the broken record, facilities are insufficient to support a viable championship franchise of any kind in Seattle. We'll need to update Safeco and Quest fields in a few years because they are no longer financially viable to host a world championship. This is to the people that say we didn’t support our team, we have a ton of local issues here that needed fixing. Faulty infrastructure, traffic congestion, high taxes, falling employment, failing schools, fuel and food price increases, and a wealthy team owner who wants a new sand box to play in. We just happened to set our priorities a little different this time around and paid the ultimate price for it.
scott, enumclaw - Jul 3, 2008 10:26 PM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtspPuAywfo for everyone that continues to think OKC is a dry, dusty cow town.
Jess, Warr Acres - Jul 3, 2008 10:26 PM
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Daniel, Seattle, does your mommy know your using the computer while she's gone? You sound like you have the maturity level of an 8 year old. It's funny that so many people from Seattle and elsewhere are making derogatory comments about Oklahomans, Oklahoma and OKC. All they are really doing is showing how childish and ignorant they are. Oh, and, tu, get back on your meds.
Larry, Carnegie - Jul 3, 2008 10:14 PM
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Much of these arguments are nonsensical, but there is one comment I have read time and again whose logic fails me more than others... many folks here are saying that we (OKC) are eventually going to lose the Sonics when the 'new wears off' and attendance fails, and then Seattle will get the team back. Seattle wouldn't be in this predicament if their game attendance wasn't absolutely horrible. The average home game attendance at an OKC minor league game has actually been greater than the number of attendees at a Seattle Sonics game for some time now. I have no idea how you convince an NBA team to come back with stats like that. Seattlites I feel your pain, but you need to stop blaming others. Your beef is with your city, and with the guy who sold your team. Trust me this was all about money and you are having the wool pulled over your eyes if you believe otherwise.
Sean, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 10:01 PM
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Martin, well said. Thanks.
UW alum here in OKC.
Walter, Edmond - Jul 3, 2008 8:48 PM
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Some of you have said the national media favors Oklahoma's position. I would beg to differ. Read ESPN's Bill Simmon's take on this heist for example:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/080228&sportCat=nba
Phil, Edmonds - Jul 3, 2008 8:03 PM
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Eric, suk eggs.
J, Anonymous - Jul 3, 2008 7:47 PM
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What I love is how Seattle said we stole there team. If they had supported, funded a new arean, had a fair lease for the team, I really don't think that this would have happened. Why did starbucks boy sell the team in the first place, because the team was a money pit and had no chance to make money. Cut your loses and get out is what he did. So now you cry like babies and call us thiefs. Grow and pair and realize that the city of Seattle and Sonics fans are the ones to blame for this. You vote to build a new arean, the team stays, you put in a fair lease agreement so the team stays, you support the team so they can turn a profit, the team stays. Maybe you can take this as a lession if you are lucy enough to get a new team. May be you won't take them for granted next time.
Todd, Yukon - Jul 3, 2008 7:03 PM
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okc Is full of nothing but country folk thieves!!!
eric, phoenix - Jul 3, 2008 6:27 PM
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And Todd in Yukon, please, get a clue. Seattle funded a complete rebuild of Key Arena, and yet in a mere EIGHT YEARS the NBA was back with their hands out demanding a new arena again. That argument is a joke.
Phil, Edmonds - Jul 3, 2008 8:05 PM
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I tuned into OKC sports radio today and what were they talking about for 20 minutes before ANY mention of the Sonics move? Sooner football.

There's a reason Oklahoma was designated for Native Americans during our westward expansion and why Oklahoma got its first pro sports team in 2008. People who live there want to leave and people who don't avoid it like the plague.
Jordan, Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 5:48 PM
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Daniel be representative of your city! Have some pride in yourself! Show us what great citizens live in Seattle! God loves Oklahoma, Seattle and even you and Clay Bennett!
c, yukon - Jul 3, 2008 5:32 PM
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Seattle, I'm sure you're as proud of your city as we are of ours. Being angry at residents of another city, calling names and being deragotory is achieving what? Is it getting the team back Seattle? NO! Be angry at your leaders and the former owner of the team. We had businessmen who merely purchased the team from people who did not want to own them any longer. Be angry at your own citizens that did not want to pay for your renovation and voted down the bonds.
You can call us all the names you want, but WE did not sell the team you love so much!
There's no need for us to attack each other.
I'm sure you all wish us to fail. We wish you nothing but good fortune in your future endevors for sports teams. Hopefully your business leaders and community leaders will see they need to find a way to get another team for you. We can spell, we can think and we are not ignorant hicks. God Bless you all and may he remove the anger from your hearts.
c, yukon - Jul 3, 2008 5:21 PM
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I'm sorry that this situation has come to this. I have lived in OK all my life. I have never heard anything bad about Seattle. I think everyone on both sides are not acting like adults. After all we are trying to do here to make this a great city it makes me sad that this is what we have done to the people of Seattle.
david, oklahoma city - Jul 3, 2008 5:51 PM
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Cucumber Sammich. That is Aberdeen. doesn't count and besides, we can make up for it by being a decent place to live and making up one of the most educated and intelligent populations in the nation. You guys....have sex with dogs and steal basketball teams. Also we have way bigger penises
daniel, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 4:55 PM
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ha ha ha bob that was funny!
tu, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 4:47 PM
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yes oklahoma is a hell hole, people who are from here always fall back onthe old yeah i know it's awful here but the people are so nice, nice is good for nothing, people here are stupid, they are not nice and if they had all their psych meds taken from tehm i dont think they'd be too "nice" at all. i hate oklahoma and i hate okies
tu, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 4:18 PM
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With so much childish name-calling and unneeded civil pride here, I doubt anybody will wade through it all and read this post - but they should, because I've managed to take a relatively unique objective stance on this subject. This is a good situation for Seattle and the state of Oklahoma. It rids us in Seattle of an ineptly run team. A team without a solid foundation to succeed in the future. A team with inexperienced or underachieving (except Collison) forwards and no answer at point guard. Why Presti picked Russell Westbrook is beyond me. Westbrook had only begun to prove himself in college, he didn't merit the fourth pick, certainly not over the likes of Jared Bayless. Now the team is led by the young and quiet Kevin Durant, who has to deal with no-defense Ridnour and no-shot Watson, neither of whom can get the ball moving - maybe because of Carlesimo, I don't know. It gives us in Seattle a chance to start over. We get to keep our colors and name, which makes this all much easier to swallow. I can only hope the new team will be better managed and intelligently built.

As for Oklahoma, it really doesn't matter. You finally have a team to call your own. Sure, I doubt this team will be any good in the next five years and certainly won't win you a championship in that time. But, with patience, you will eventually have a winner in your hands and with no competition for major league sports, I'm sure you will all manage to keep that patience.

For all the Oklahoma fans who didn't partake in the silly name-calling, I apologize for remarks made by people in my city. I'm sure you understand they were mostly made out of bitterness, not hate. As for you all being rednecks, whatever. Who cares. Good luck and have fun.

In the meantime, I'm a blazers fan, I already liked the team anyway.
Martin, Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 4:15 PM
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What will be interesting is to see if and how many of the players currently on the team opt out or resign with a different team at the end of the contracts
phillip, Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 3:57 PM
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there is nothing worthwhile about oklahoma
tu, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 3:53 PM
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It's great for OKC and OK! I just hope OK gives them the proper support! GO OKC!
lisa, Edmond - Jul 3, 2008 6:57 PM
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everyone keeps saying that we're gonna fail in two-five years when the new wears off...
however, OU football still perks my interest, even thru the bad weather times. the blazers (who aren't even a major league team) still attracts loads of people as do the redhawks. you cats don't understand the love affair we okies have with sports.
you know what's really gonna happen in five years.... OKC bringing home the NBA title!
BOOYAKASHA!
edcrunk, okc - Jul 3, 2008 3:47 PM
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Had no idea I was talking to a 5 year old. Don't you have summer chores to be doing?
bob, oklahoma city - Jul 3, 2008 3:42 PM
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Your state still sucks!
daniel, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 3:39 PM
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thanks bob
daniel, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 3:38 PM
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oh, that was in washington on the front page of the seattle times website.
bob, oklahoma city - Jul 3, 2008 3:36 PM
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daniel, a women stabbed a pregnant woman to death, cut out her baby from the womb, and tried to pass it off as hers at a hospital. there are messed up people everywhere.
bob, oklahoma city - Jul 3, 2008 3:36 PM
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www.myspace.com/oklahomacityrocks
edcrunk, okc - Jul 3, 2008 3:33 PM
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OKC is the SH!T! i was SHINY TOY GUNS first tour manager and am one of oklahoma's premiere DJ's and have traveled and lived across the nation. every band and dj we bring thru is amazed at our crowds and the energy we bring. there's tons of stuff to do, however there may not be as many options as other cities... you can still drive across town in 20 minutes and i live like a king for little money. besides... the people here are what makes OKC so special. who cares if there is more stuff to do in seattle or LA... it's not that fun when everyone you're partying with is a fake, plastic, shallow @$$hole.
edcrunk, okc - Jul 3, 2008 3:26 PM
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Oh yes i forgot to include this fun equation. Oklahoma women love to have sex with dogs for money and fun.
daniel, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 3:24 PM
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Dear people of OKC, I don't know how you can possibly be happy about any of this. You are STEALING our team. Despite what you redneck pieces of garbage may think, we do care about the Sonics and we got screwed. Dawn may be an idiot for thinking Seattle sucks, but she is right on about OKC. I read a sweet article today on your site about a dog sex tape scandal in Tulsa. This in no way suprises anyone outside of the state of Oklahoma, because, quite frankly we expect nothing more from you people. Perhaps the OKC Dog *****ers would be a good name for your newly stolen team! I hope they fail, just as you all fail at life. Cheers
daniel, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 3:21 PM
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I really don't care what fans in Seattle think. Don't care for Star_ucks coffee either. It just shows you put up or shut up. Apparently Seattle chose neither but to whine and file frivouls lawsuits. Hope you enjoy our OKC team. As we didn't care for or acknowledge NBA in Seattle. By the wat the Grizzles will move to Philly. They don't care for your coffee either.
David, edmond - Jul 3, 2008 3:15 PM
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As a Seattle Super Sonics fan since the 70's as a kid I am sad. This is no ones fault but Howard Schultz and the politicians. I do not blame Clay, but do blame him for being a liar and committing perjury in court. (about his emails)
My question to you fans is how do you feel about Clay wanting to share Seattle's history? Do you all share your women too? What a sleezy idea of Clay! Do you get off hanging a banner that has noting to do with OKC and a replica trophy?
ExposeClayBennett@gmail.com
Aaron , Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 2:56 PM
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I used to live in Enid and travel to "the city" every weekend. It wasn't exactly my favorite place to live, but true to its name, it was "OK." The Sonics were a small part of the bounty of Seattle, and as a Seattleite, I'm happy to share. Let the billionaires fight...I just hope the people of OKC benefit from it in some way. They will treat the team well, I am sure, and it will be good family fun. Enjoy.
Jill, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 1:32 PM
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"to all you people from Seattle, heres a quarter, call someone who cares!"
I hope you remember that when the smallest market in the NBA fails after 5 or so years.
chris, seattle - Jul 3, 2008 12:53 PM
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Just wanted to clarify because some of you think I said Seattle sucks. I didn't, when I said they both suck I was meaning Oklahoma city and the Team [ check out how many wins they have had in the last five years guys, get real ] I love Seattle, I lived here awhile in 1997 and moved back because I much preferred it to any other city I have lived in. I will live out the rest of my life here. And Jay, I have been up here longer then a month, I think you were thinking of your sister you saw on the corner...Oh SNAP!!
Dawn, Kent - Jul 3, 2008 6:32 PM
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Dawn, glad to hear you left. Place is MUCH better now.
David, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 12:05 PM
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I was born in Oklahoma and have lived in a few states since then, I just moved back to Seattle after living in Oklahoma City for the last 10 years and I can say more honestly then any of you who have lived in one city but not the other that Oklahoma City can have the Sonics because they both SUCK! Oklahoma City never does anything right, remember how the Maps project was supposed to be so great. While it DID improve downtown everything down there is smaller and not as great as what it was promised to be. I give it 2 years before the novelty of a NBA team wears off and no one is going to the games anymore just like every sports team you guys have had and lost, compared to Seattle your city has nothing to offer the players and they will start moving to other cities as soon as their contracts are up. Sorry, but to put it plainly, OKC is boring to someone who has lived in a Five star city all their life. After the team fails like all the others we in Seattle will be happy to know that Clay will NEVER make back the money he has put out to "steal" the team from another city. Maybe he will learn a lesson.
Dawn, Kent - Jul 3, 2008 12:01 PM
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The City of Seattle, Mayor Nickols sold this team out and is not honest with us and did not stick up for the team in general against Mr. Bennett who has been lying to Seattle community since he bought the team.
David, Federal Way - Jul 3, 2008 11:56 AM
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Talking about name calling, The nickname "Supersonics" will stay in Seattle. How about Oklahoma Thunderbolts for a change for this franchise?
Javed, Riverside - Jul 3, 2008 11:55 AM
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I totally agree Rick, We are better off not having these liars in our community. And like I said earlier I have nothing against OKC and I would refuse to call anyone names. It was a total money thing and it all just seems underhanded.
David, Federal Way - Jul 3, 2008 11:54 AM
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Good morning- Mayor of Settle...
Rick, Yakima - Jul 3, 2008 11:53 AM
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Not "Enjoyed" losing them but enjoyed that we gave them HELL...
Rick, Yakima - Jul 3, 2008 11:52 AM
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Congrats again to OKC--I'm not as bummed as I thought I would be about losing the team. I grew up idolizing them..now other things are important to me....HOWEVER...I wish the city would have fought this to the bitter end...and that even if that meant we lost in the end...AND NEVER GOT ANOTHER TEAM..EVER...then the rest of the nation would take note and never let another bunch of LIARS and Billionares bully a city again...I truly would have enjoyed losing the team FOVEVER...or possible winning the Shultz lawsuit...instead...money talked
Rick, Yakima - Jul 3, 2008 11:51 AM
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to all you people from Seattle, heres a quarter, call someone who cares!
Don, Norman - Jul 3, 2008 11:51 AM
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Nobody is mad because some crooked business man who lied to the people of the City of Seattle and the State of Washington about his true intentions with the Sonics when purchasing the team. "We" didn't sell, Mr. Starbucks Howard Schultz did, and the way Bennett has played this off, it's been a sabatoge from the start of depressed fans just waiting for the move of the team that obviously was in-evitable. But then again with the unbiased news reporting of the Oklahoman, i'm sure you new all of that right lol??
Jay, Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 11:37 AM
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David, it is not about name calling. It is about holding people accountable for what they are saying. I have nothing against OKC. I have a problem with Greg Nickols, Christine Gregroie, Clay Bennett, and David Stern, they have not be hoest with the City of Seattle, and they have done this city a great injustice. I am not name calling, I am calling out the liars.
David, Federal Way - Jul 3, 2008 11:32 AM
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I mean you'd have to be an idiot to think that our state lawmakers would approve of a $500,000,000 arena project that Clay hadn't even offered any of their own private funds up front to pay for, knowing full well that he could just pull a sweet flip and move the team after the lease was up anyway, with no reassurance that he planned to keep the team here after the end of the lease. What person in their right mind wouldn't find that to be a shady deal? I don't know how politicians operate down in Oklahoma. But one thing I know is Seattle and the Western Washington region didn't become the 14th largest sales market in the nation by catering to the will of every crooked business man with lopsided ideas for his own use of taxpayer money. Good luck taxpayers of Oklahoma, you're really gonna need it.
Jay, Seattle - Jul 3, 2008 11:26 AM
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Sure seems that Seattle is quite adept at name calling.
Hope that will make all your parents proud!
Just wave goodbye to the vans. Might look into some
personal responsibility courses also. You sold, we bought. And you are angry with us? What a joke.
Better take care of your other pro sports before someone up there sells them.
David, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 11:25 AM
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For those of you who say that the players do not want to come and play in Oklahoma, I say Baloney! Players go where the money tells them to go. Players are paid to play the game!
Jay, Guthrie - Jul 3, 2008 11:24 AM
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I agree Robert in Norman. I'm from Chicago and have lived in OKC for eight years. This is a wonderful city and Oklahomans are great people. It amazes me every day reading the aweful things Americans are saying about this great place. "Redneck" From my experience travelling around the country, every state in this union has "rednecks" including Washington, Illinois, New York, California the entire USA. God bless us all. I'm proud to say that I'm an Oklahoman. How can we treat Americans the way we are with good conscience. Does everyone realize Mr. Bennett and Mr. Schultz have to have body guards because of death threats. Give me a break. Go give someone you love a hug and worry about something more important. We're Americans, if you want to hate us go somewhere else.
John, Oklahoma City - Jul 3, 2008 11:23 AM
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Mike , Portland - Jul 3, 2008 11:19 AM
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Mike , Portland - Jul 3, 2008 11:19 AM
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The real issue here folks, is that you have a sports team demanding public funds, whose owner just proved how much he values leases. So in other words owners tell communities, "you folks spend $300 million to spiff up your arena, let us use it free of charge, and we just might pack up and leave in several years if we feel like it."

Not a great deal when teachers make 1/200th of some of these sports contracts. And add to that a league that throws games for tv ratings and won't call fouls on favorite players, and you're getting the World Wrestling Federation on a baseketball court. This is the state of professional basketball.

The problem with marital affairs is the "victor" ends up with a partner w